--- Log opened Thu Apr 04 00:00:03 2019
03:09 < aestetix> fuck yes
03:09 < aestetix> https://thehill.com/policy/finance/434567-dems-formally-ask-for-trumps-tax-returns
03:09 < PigBot> Dems formally ask for Trump's tax returns | TheHill (at thehill.com) http://tinyurl.com/y26k8a7s
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05:48 <@brimstone> why do we want his tax returns so bad?
05:49 <@brimstone> but his tax return!
06:53 <@Shadow404> because, thats a great way to see how much he isnt actually reporting
06:53 <@Shadow404> it can also help to prove any illegal activities
06:53 <@Shadow404> not directly, but indirectly
07:09 < xray> Get a warrant.
07:09 < xray> or go away.
07:10 < xray> either the laws work for all of us, or none of us
07:12 <@Shadow404> xray: tax returns are public domain
07:13 <@Shadow404> except for those with moeny and power
07:13 <@Shadow404> if you went through all the red tape, i could get access to your return and vica versa
07:15 < xray> sad, very sad
07:19 <@Corydon76> Shadow404: I don't think that's correct.  Tax returns are generally privileged.
07:20 <@Corydon76> The only tax forms that are public are Form 990 and its derivatives, for public benefit nonprofits
07:21 <@Corydon76> Public corporations may be the same way, but it would be because they're owned by the public.
07:28 <@Shadow404> Corydon76: if that is true, we should still be able to see his public corps
07:28 <@Corydon76> Shadow404: As far as I'm aware, he didn't run any public corporations.
07:28 <@Corydon76> All of his businesses were either private corporations or LLCs.
07:30 <@Corydon76> Well, there was the Trump Foundation, but that's been since shut down by state regulators, and they were able to do so pretty easily, because the financials were public.
07:32 <@Shadow404> well, a little researcha and both xray and you are right
07:34 <@Shadow404> but in general history, most presidents have released their returns. BUt this is interesting.https://www.taxnotes.com/presidential-tax-returns
07:34 < PigBot> Presidential Tax Returns (at www.taxnotes.com)
07:34 <@Shadow404> we only have 1 return from 2005 for trump, and then look at how many other presidents have made their own returns public
07:36 <@Shadow404> only Gerald ford on the first page of presidents kept his private life Trump
07:37 < xray> I don't release mine and I don't expect them to release theirs. Same goes for birth certificates.
07:38 < xray> If I wanted to share my privates I would have a Facebook page.
07:38 < xray> Don't bother looking I don't have one.
07:39 < xray> And it's not because I'm old (everyone assumes that). I'ts because of what I used to do and knowing what can be done with that kind of data.
07:39 < xray> This should be required reading: http://grugq.github.io/
07:39 < PigBot> Hacker OPSEC (at grugq.github.io) http://tinyurl.com/p2llhpb
07:40 < xray> People suck at OPSEC
07:40 < xray> sometimes I'm not so great at that but at least I try
07:40 < xray> Most people give it a hand wave and off to the races.
07:41 < aestetix> Shadow404: that site is actually incorrect
07:41 < aestetix> We have two returns from Trump. One of them is from 2005, and one is from... 1992 or something
07:41 <@Corydon76> The problem with having no social presence is that people tend to look harder at the "other" to find details.  It is useful to have a public presence, but hide the details you don't want to be public.
07:42 < xray> II have linkedin for that
07:42 < xray> which says where I work and nothing else
07:43 < aestetix> Corydon76: I have no "social" media presence anymore, and I'm much happier that way.
07:43 <@Corydon76> For the purposes of operational security, I'd suggest that you create a carefully curated page with details that otherwise say nothing or are purposefully misleading.
07:43 < aestetix> Now this has lead to some issues regarding expectations.
07:43 < xray> If you want to know details you have to buy me coffee and even then I might not tell you. Kind of depends on how good the coffee is and if it is the February 31st.
07:43 < aestetix> For example, sending a friend I hadn't seen in a while a "how's it going" message just to be kind
07:44 < aestetix> And finding out the hard way that she'd posted the previous day on social media she had miscarriage
07:44 < aestetix> and by "message" I mean email
07:45 < xray> If you post it by any means it is public
07:45 <@Corydon76> For example, saying I live in Nashville is somewhat misleading.  I don't live in metro, per se, though I do live in the area.
07:45 < aestetix> xray: well I consider email private
07:45 < aestetix> Since I "post" the message to whoever is in the "to" header
07:45 < aestetix> Corydon76: how does that help operational security?
07:45 < xray> aestetix: I know people treat it that way but it isn't. By law a person who receives email can do what ever they want with it.
07:46 <@opticron> I really love those threats they put at the bottom of emails
07:46 <@Corydon76> aestetix: it provides a comforting veneer for those who go looking for information, and they are less inclined to dig deeper
07:46 < aestetix> Corydon76: ahh so it's sort of a passive honeypot
07:46 < aestetix> It satisfies someone and they stop bothering about it
07:46 < xray> China has this funky thing they do with mapping that done of Google's maps are correct
07:46 <@Corydon76> Precisely
07:47 < aestetix> Corydon76: as long as you're not required to update it more than once every few years, that seems like a reasonable compromise
07:47 <@Corydon76> Anybody whose information is closely held rings alarm bells.
07:47 < xray> A carefully crafted and curated presence is considered tradecraft.
07:49 < xray> I can chalk a lack of "presence" up to being a curmudgeon. When it is anything but that. Then again saying that here kind of ruins it. :)
07:49 <@Corydon76> Depending upon the level that you want to go to, adding various social media "mistakes" on a regular basis can provide authenticity, possibly giving false leads to someone wishing to corrupt your position in the organization
07:50 < xray> People are profoundly bad at random so even false data can reveal a pattern.
07:51 < xray> Most people do not have the patience for serious tradecraft.
07:51 < xray> You have almost be OCD about it.
07:51 <@Corydon76> It doesn't need to be random.  It could be a pattern of false drunk driving arrests, especially for someone who doesn't actually drink.
07:52 <@Corydon76> Or a slipped "Like" of a BDSM page for a person who is straight-laced
07:52 < aestetix> Ok see
07:52 < aestetix> This is why I think the world would be better without "social" media
07:53 <@Corydon76> The idea is to provide someone looking to corrupt you by giving them false leads, ways they think they can blackmail you into doing something, that will simply reveal them to be a bad actor, and the organization can respond accordingly.
07:53 < xray> Interesting. Would make a nice way of making an OPSEC honeypot. You look like you could be turned but it is for attracting flies.
07:53 <@Corydon76> Precisely
07:53 < xray> That could be fun.
07:54 < xray> Wait what am I saying!
07:54 < xray> I'm not getting back into that.
07:54 <@brimstone> ... before lunch
07:54 < xray> And that is way darker than I every operated.
07:55 < xray> Hey brimstone (wave)
07:55 <@brimstone> hi!
07:55 < xray> The potential projects are piling up around me faster than I can organize them, let alone do them.
07:56 < xray> To many things to hack, to little time.
07:56 <@brimstone> i hacked a book! https://github.com/brimstone/manual/releases/download/1.0.0/manual.1.0.0.pdf
07:56 < PigBot> None (at github.com)
07:57 < xray> Wow. That is awesome. Thanks.
07:57 < aestetix> brimstone: how is masscan faster than nmap?
07:58 < aestetix> oh because of the "rate" command I gues
07:58 <@brimstone> it uses its own tcp stack and takes a ton of shortcuts with the protocol
07:58 < aestetix> ok
07:58 <@brimstone> it doesn't use the kernels and doesn't have all of that overhead
07:59 < xray> My you have been busy. Programming a super computer, writing a book, hosting CTFs. When do you sleep.
07:59 < aestetix> you hosted a CTF?
07:59 < xray> by super computer I mean brimstone v2.0
07:59 <@brimstone> the little super computer kinda programs itself now
08:00 <@brimstone> just got to keep it fed and diaper changed
08:00 < aestetix> oh nice congrats
08:00 < xray> Yeah right. Trust me, he is tricking you into programming him.
08:00 <@brimstone> aestetix: i used to host a CTF at atl2600 and dc404 on the regular. i took some time off for little v2.0, but now getting back into it
08:01 <@brimstone> xray: yeah, but it's so much fun
08:01 <@brimstone> aestetix: thanks!
08:02 < xray> brimstone: Yes I agree, kids are the best and surprisingly even more fun when the get older.
08:02 < aestetix> You know you're getting older when the response to "I'm pregnant" changes from "oh shit" to "congrats!"
08:02 < xray> I may play this week. Haven't decided. Yeah right, as soon as I see the scoreboard I'll be in.
08:03 <@brimstone> aestetix: yup
08:03 < xray> I rarely get to play.
08:08 <@brimstone> tomorrow's your chance!
08:08 <@brimstone> but i think you have more fun chatting with people :)
08:09 <@Evilpig> aestetix: you're missing an opportunity to say "is it yours?"
08:09 <@brimstone> absolutely not, this is my wife's baby
08:10 <@brimstone> she did all of the workd
08:10 <@brimstone> i just helped her steal it
08:10 <@Evilpig> and kids are not the best
08:10 <@Evilpig> the little sociopath of a 10yr old we've taken in has me questioning why anyone would ever NOT beat a child
08:11 <@Evilpig> this little cunt was purposely harassing an autistic kid on her bus because she wanted to see him cover his ears and rock back and forth because it was funny
08:12 <@Corydon76> Tell her the kid rocking back and forth is the last thing before the kid explodes like a bomb and kills everybody on the bus, including her.
08:13 <@Evilpig> she'd want to see that
08:13 <@Corydon76> Do not arm the fuse.
08:13 <@Corydon76> Sounds like she needs one of those rough camps for wayward youths
08:13 <@Evilpig> she's about to get kicked off the bus for her antics and she's only on it for 5 minutes.  less than 1 fucking mile from the school and she's causing enough havok they want to boot her off
08:14 <@Corydon76> Anything to scare some sense back into them
08:14 <@Corydon76> So she should walk to school, then, like I had to do.
08:14 <@Evilpig> she was sat in a chair last night and made to sit still without flapping her gums for 5 minutes and told if she did anything outside of that it was going to be a swat.  turns out the threat of a beating DOES induce behavioral change
08:15 <@Corydon76> A couple days of walking to school may make her decide that behaving on the bus is better... before she gets banned from the bus
08:16 <@Evilpig> that walking to school would involve me walking her to school across OHB, hard pass
08:17 < aestetix> brimstone: have you seen the movie Raising Arizona?
08:17 <@brimstone> nope
08:17 <@Evilpig> I did consider that first though
08:17 < aestetix> brimstone: you should
08:17 <@Corydon76> How far is OHB from her school?
08:17 <@Evilpig> on it
08:18 <@Corydon76> Ah, so not a case where you can just drop her off on the other side and let her walk the rest of the way
08:18 <@Evilpig> https://goo.gl/maps/1FvGgCwzYhz
08:18 < PigBot>  Google Maps  (at goo.gl)
08:19 <@Evilpig> no.  there's also the issue of I40 between here and there too
08:26 <@Corydon76> There's also the parental embarassment factor.  Suppose you dropped her off while wearing a dress, and similarly when you picked her up in the afternoon.  She might be mortified at the prospect of being teased about her male parent wearing nontraditional clothes.
08:27 <@Corydon76> Everytime she misbehaves in school, she will be made to regret having you come to the school property
08:27 <@Evilpig> We've talked to teh school about me showing up and I have an open invite, but they're also trying to get her under control without me being there
08:27 <@Evilpig> they've seen the change in her attitude when I show up.  she immediately straightens up
08:28 <@Corydon76> Well, at least she respects you.  That's one battle you don't have to fight.
08:29 <@Evilpig> respect or fear, don't care which i'll take it
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08:41 <@Dolemite> mr0ning, be0tches and h0ez!
08:44 <@Shadow404> yet another reason not to ever have kids
08:45  * aestetix hugs Dolemite 
08:45 <@Dolemite> So here's the ultimate in red tape for you
08:45 < aestetix> I can also give a number of reasons why Shadow404 shouldn't have kids
08:45 <@Shadow404> aestetix: thats been handled
08:45 <@Shadow404> no reproduction for me
08:46 <@Dolemite> I am no longer required to have a clearance (never even used it), so when it came time for my renewal, they dropped it
08:46 <@Shadow404> aestetix: and you were late by 4 minutes for his hug. Get your shit together
08:46 <@Corydon76> Shadow404: the problem is, if you don't have kids, you're going to need to have enough retirement savings to last you from retirement to death
08:46 <@Dolemite> I'm told to go swap my badge this morning
08:46 <@Shadow404> Corydon76: got a plan for that too
08:46 <@Corydon76> And if you live longer than that, you're screwed
08:46 <@Dolemite> They gave me a U (uncleared) badge...  but not an HSPD-12 badge
08:46 <@Dolemite> HSPD-12 is required for elevating to priv access on the computer systems
08:47 <@Dolemite> Guess how long they're telling me it will be before my HSPD-12 is ready?
08:47 <@Shadow404> 2 weeks?
08:47 <@Corydon76> 3 months
08:47 <@Dolemite> "about a week"
08:47 <@Shadow404> we're a bit pestimistic
08:47 <@Corydon76> It's government.  They're slow.
08:47 <@Dolemite> Well we have our own badging office, otherwise it would be somewhere between your two guesses
08:47 <@Shadow404> how long is "about a week" in reality though?
08:48 <@Corydon76> It's an hour if they're properly motivated.
08:48 < aestetix> what is HSPD?
08:48 <@Corydon76> It's 3 months, if not.
08:48 <@Dolemite> HSPD-12 = Homeland Security Presidential Directive (20)12
08:48 < aestetix> oh so you're a fed
08:49 <@Shadow404> aestetix: and he plays with nuclear material
08:49 <@Corydon76> 2012?  Obama era, Trump will want to rescind it.
08:50 <@Dolemite> I'm not a fed, I work for UT-Battelle, which is the prime contractor under DOE that operates ORNL
08:50 <@Dolemite> And no, I don't play with nuclear material, unless you consider your mom to be radioactive
08:51 <@Shadow404> her boobs probably have some residual isotopes left
09:05 <@dasunt> So why does Outlook not allow multiple reminders?
09:42 <@Corydon76> You have to ask why a Microsoft product is deficient in some way?
09:44 <@Corydon76> They will assume that another product will fill the gap, until it becomes too noticeable, in which case they will tender a single offer to buy the company out, and if the offer is declined, they'll write the feature and put the company out of business anyway.  SOP.
10:05 <@Shadow404> Do any of those that are managing business networks use the default diffserv values?
10:05 <@Shadow404> Or do ya'll slightly modify your set values?
10:06 <@Corydon76> If by using the defaults, you mean that we don't bother with configuring them, yes.
10:07 <@Corydon76> We use VLANs with reserved bandwidth to do the same thing.
10:07 <@Shadow404> for voip im assuming?
10:07 <@Corydon76> Right
10:08 <@Shadow404> where do you start the trusat boundary usually? from the phone or at the switch or higher?
10:08 <@Shadow404> *trust
10:08 <@Corydon76> The phones themselves aren't smart enough to 'know' about VLANs
10:09 <@Corydon76> So it's the switch that handles it all
10:09 <@Shadow404> fair enough
10:09 <@Shadow404> i havent even gotten into ip phone config yet
10:10 <@Corydon76> I know some phones like Polycoms support it, ostensibly to allow piggybacking a physical connection with computers.  i.e. the computer connects to the phone, which connects to the physical plant, and then _may_ use VLAN differentiation to separate the traffic.  But I've never deployed it in that fashion.
10:11 <@Shadow404> thats the way cisco works
10:11 <@Shadow404> its tagged on the phone
10:11 <@Corydon76> Right
10:12 <@Corydon76> I've certainly dealt with Ciscos, but I'm much more familiar with Polycom, especially because Polycom doesn't require constantly updating licenses to ensure that the phones still work.
10:13 <@Corydon76> Because Cisco regards themselves as a software company, you can't legally use their phones unless the license for the software running on the phone is up to date.
10:14 <@Shadow404> why do they do that?
10:14 <@Shadow404> i mean, im sure not everyone keeps them updated
10:14 <@Corydon76> Honestly?  I think they do it to keep revenue flowing.
10:15 <@Shadow404> just like re-certs, which is what im doing and what started my question
10:15 <@Corydon76> They're essentially recession-proof if you have to keep paying them to keep their equipment running even in a downturn.
10:16 <@Corydon76> It's not a stupid business strategy.  But it is a giant PITA to their customers.
10:24  * dasunt would prefer his company not to throw out working documentation and rewrite that from scratch, but WTF, I'm tempted to put in my two weeks notice on May 15th anyways.
10:27 <@dasunt> Since I'm wishing for things, it would be nice for people to actually pay attention to when a script errors.
10:27 <@dasunt> But ignoring it is fine as well.
10:41 <@Corydon76> Dolemite: did the panic at Y12 this morning extend over to your facility?
10:42 <@Dolemite> Not that I'm aware of
10:43 <@Corydon76> From what I can glean, they had some alert over hydrofluoric acid.
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13:00 < aestetix> wow
13:00 < aestetix> seeing the news about /r/gaming
13:00 < aestetix> what a clusterfuck
13:01 < aestetix> er /r/games my bad
13:36 < oddball> I'm not sure I want to know.
13:50 < aestetix> so I gotta ask
13:50 < aestetix> how does Rachel Maddow still have a job
13:50 < aestetix> she's terrible
15:02 <@Shadow404> Corydon76: followup, apparently cisco phones can do their own qos marking before its sent to the switch on up
15:52 < oddball> aestetix: There's a large percentage of the US population that is convinced that Trump is a Russian plot.
15:55 <@Evilpig> he isn't?
15:55 <@Evilpig> we talking tv series plot?  b movie?  pink and the brain but more real and scary?
15:55 <@Evilpig> pinky*
15:56 <@Corydon76> oddball: I don't know about Russian plot.  They do think Putin was trying to screw up the 2016 election, so he wouldn't have to face Hillary in power.
15:58 <@Corydon76> And the US wasn't the only country Russia was messing with.  They also had a hand in screwing with the French elections.
15:58 <@Corydon76> And possibly the Brexit vote
16:00 <@Corydon76> The alleged goal was "Screw up the West so much, that they won't realize when Russia makes its play to be the next sole world power."
17:58 <@_NSAKEY> All of the Trump drama has provided great ways to troll the far-right conservatives.
17:58 <@_NSAKEY> Try calling them things like Comrade.
18:01 <@_NSAKEY> Corydon76: To touch on a point you made earlier, in the case of Trump University... There was no paperwork, ever, so no returns.
18:02 <@_NSAKEY> They just didn't bother filing the paperwork to make it an actual entity.
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23:55 < K`Tetch_> going back 16 hours, on the tax returns, Tax returns are priviledged, but Congress can subpoena specific individuals tax returns, if they can show a legitimate investigative interest. A president who has extensive financial irregulatiries an a history of fraud, is a legitimate interst, as it opens him blackmail
--- Log closed Fri Apr 05 00:00:02 2019