--- Log opened Wed Jan 23 00:00:48 2019
00:37 < K`Tetch> yeah, Evilpig_, he first broached it with me maybe 3 years ago... even asked me to be in a podcast 9 months ago, not heard from him since dragoncon at all
00:38 < K`Tetch> (and even then I was off my face, as I'd been drinking all my steampunk gifts of miniatures after the masquerade)
00:46 < aestetix> ugh more meetings today
00:46 < aestetix> I really wonder if I pissed off some karmic force
08:24 <@oddball> aestetix: here you go https://www.amazon.com/survived-another-meeting-should-email/dp/B01NCTTSS6
08:24 < PigBot> Amazon.com: I survived another meeting... should have been an email - Funny coffee mug by Donbicentenario - 11OZ Ceramic - Best gift or souvenir. SHIPS FROM USA: Kitchen & Dining (at www.amazon.com) http://tinyurl.com/yaunktpo
08:26 < aestetix> Corydon76: I heard a rumor that Derbycon is going to go to invite only
08:27 <@Corydon76> How credible is this rumor?
08:27 < aestetix> hard to say
08:28 < aestetix> but it would be logical
08:28 <@Corydon76> You know that rumors can be non-credible, even if they're true
08:28 < aestetix> Then again, I know some drama went down there last year, and I've heard several versions of the story
08:28 <@Corydon76> So it sounds like it's not a credible rumor at this point.
08:29 < aestetix> So I treat the rumors like going private with the same credibility
08:29 <@Corydon76> The official announcement was pretty explicit without naming names
08:59 <@Shadow404> what kind of drama?
08:59 <@Shadow404> like Skydogcon?
09:01 <@Corydon76> You're better off just reading the official announcement, yourself.
09:01 < aestetix> ^
09:02 <@Shadow404> limny?
09:02 <@Shadow404> *linky?
09:02 <@Corydon76> In a nutshell, people were assholes to others
09:02 <@Corydon76> And the con organizers didn't feel like becoming therapists.
09:02 <@Shadow404> they should of hired my wife, shes certified
09:03 < aestetix> Corydon76: good way to summarize it
09:03 <@Corydon76> https://www.derbycon.com/blog/derbycon-9-0-every-beginning-has-an-end/
09:03 < PigBot> DerbyCon 9.0 – Every Beginning Has an End – DerbyCon: Louisville INFOSEC Con (at www.derbycon.com) http://tinyurl.com/y8tnhavb
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09:06 <@Shadow404> wow, thats sorta fucked up
09:07 <@Shadow404> but we've had the same pains with local cons too, especially IZ, OZ, and PN
09:07 < aestetix> well there's a culture civil war going on
09:07 < aestetix> although that's a little reductionist
09:07 < aestetix> there is a multifacted battle
09:08 < aestetix> and unfortunately the fringe lunatics are getting all the airtime
09:08 <@Corydon76> I agree.  And as a con organizer, you get put in a no-win situation.  If you take action, you're going to upset some portion of the attendees, and if you refuse to take action, you upset some portion of the attendees.
09:08 < aestetix> Corydon76: yep
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09:11 <@Corydon76> People who are knowledgable as fuck also frequently tend to have strong opinions that are going to offend some people.  So do you exclude knowledgable people, or do you tolerate the offensiveness?  How do you mediate a middle ground to that?
09:11 < xray> K`Tetch_: There is an atlcon in the making but not being done by dru. I can put you in touch with the organizers.
09:11 <@Corydon76> To use a dead example, Bobby Fischer, an undeniable great in chess.  Also, an unabashed anti-Semite.
09:12 <@Shadow404> hmmm, looking forward to an atlcon
09:13 < aestetix> Corydon76: well, if you have someone like that to speak on a topic, you can request that he does not share those views at the event
09:13 <@Corydon76> aestetix: You can request it, but what do you do when he ignores your request?
09:13 < aestetix> Immediately condemn the views
09:13 <@Shadow404> boot him, turn off the mic and have security remove him, and publicly condemn his views as a con
09:14 <@Corydon76> Except that there's a vocal minority demanding that we eject him.
09:14 < aestetix> I think that would be grounds to uninvite him, or to ensure he's never invited again
09:14 <@Shadow404> have him sign a document before hand and all
09:14 < aestetix> Corydon76: yeah there's no way to please that crowd
09:14 <@Shadow404> so you have some legitimate legal ground
09:14 <@Corydon76> aestetix: Precisely
09:15 < aestetix> But yeah, if a speaker goes out of scope and says shit about the jews or whatever
09:15 <@Corydon76> If you eject him, there's going to be a different vocal minority saying how they felt cheated by not being able to interact with him before he was ejected
09:15 < aestetix> I think it is reasonable to publicly condemn the views and state that the speaker is no longer welcome at the event
09:17 <@Corydon76> Or John Draper.  For years, Defcon had a patrol keeping him isolated from young boys, even while they let him attend.
09:19 <@Corydon76> I don't think I'd invite him in the first place, but PN was never set up to have a security detail follow around an attendee and keep him away from young boys.
09:23 <@Corydon76> (And yes, I'm perfectly aware of the irony of me writing that.  However, I will point out that every guy I slept with at PN was over 18 and consenting.)
09:24 <@Shadow404> awww, i still remember the first pn i attended and both you and strick hit on me
10:13 < aestetix> The Draper thing is more complicated. Partly because while over the years I heard a lot about his "energy massage", I never actually knew anyone who had personally gotten one
10:13 < aestetix> Of course after the news broke, it turned out I did know two people who got one, both of whom said it was totally consentual and respectful
10:15 < aestetix> I also have issues with how the buzzfeed article was producted, but that's more on buzzfeed than on Draper.
10:15 < aestetix> produced*
10:27 <@Corydon76> Draper wouldn't have had nearly the controversy if he had kept to >= 18.
10:28 <@Corydon76> Screwing around with minors is a recipe for notoriety.
10:28 < aestetix> Corydon76: I don't recall the specifics from the buzzfeed article right now, were there people in it who were under 18 at the time?
10:28 < aestetix> Since I thought that drama was a consent issue, not an age issue
10:29 <@Corydon76> Psyode got hit on when he was 14, I believe
10:30 < aestetix> by John Draper?
10:30 <@Corydon76> Yes
10:30 <@Corydon76> He was definitely underage
10:30 < aestetix> huh
10:31 < aestetix> yeah I will defend something if it seems "creepy", but not if it's illegal
10:31 <@Corydon76> Well, it may not have been illegal, either
10:32 <@Corydon76> If he never touched them below the beltline, (or had them touch him), then it's probably not illegal.
10:34 <@Corydon76> But as soon as you get into "probably not illegal", you're seriously into gray area, which you should probably avoid, especially around minors.
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10:48 <@Mirage> yeah...sorry, but with how broad "assault" and "sexual assault" can be defined, any interration between two people which includes ANY phisical contact whatsoever fits under the heading of "grey area" anymore
10:48  * Mirage obviously needs more coffee or something.  holy typos..
10:51 <@Corydon76> In all of our interactions, have you ever seen a time when me touching you, other than incidental brushes, would have been taken as anything other than a come-on?
10:52 <@Corydon76> I don't think we've ever even shaken hands in the time we've known one another.
10:53 <@Corydon76> That is our culture.  We don't touch, unless we're showing affection or sympathy.
11:18 <@dasunt> So you are Scandinavians?
11:49 <@Corydon76> In lineage, I'm British and German.
11:53 <@dasunt> So roughly Scandinavian, way back.
11:54 <@dasunt> Tulsi Gabbard sounds a little nutty.
11:55 <@Corydon76> That's putting it mildly.
11:55 <@dasunt> Pro Assad, and probably now a crypto-homophobe.
11:55 <@Corydon76> If you're wondering who Jason Serfass is to me, he's my middle school bully.
11:56 <@Corydon76> Was held back several times, so he was bigger than all of us in the same grade.
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13:14 <@dasunt> He's kind of acting like an idiot.
13:29 <@Corydon76> He's a typical blue collar guy, and it's guys like him who are why Trump was elected.
13:30 <@Corydon76> It's not enough to know that racism exists.  If he doesn't see it with his own two eyes, then it doesn't exist, as far as he's concerned.
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19:00 < Synx_hm> mother of fuck
19:01 < Synx_hm> our house buyer just walked away from the contract, fml
19:04 <@opticron> D:
19:16 < Evilpig_> hostmonster just locked my account for malware
19:16 < Evilpig_> /home2/wilpigco/public_html/loc: SL-PHP-BACKDOOR-GENERIC-md5-bgom.UNOFFICIAL FOUND
19:16 < Evilpig_> ----------- SCAN SUMMARY -----------
19:16 < Evilpig_> Known viruses: 2078695
19:16 < Evilpig_> Engine version: devel-clamav-0.99-beta1-632-g8a582c7
19:16 < Evilpig_> Scanned directories: 1857
19:16 < Evilpig_> Scanned files: 16347
19:16 < Evilpig_> Infected files: 1
19:16 < Evilpig_> Data scanned: 387.72 MB
19:16 < Evilpig_> Data read: 586.38 MB (ratio 0.66:1)
19:16 < Evilpig_> Time: 213.320 sec (3 m 33 s)
19:16 < Evilpig_> 1 file, that is a partial bash script that was uploaded back in 2017
19:48 < Evilpig_> motherfucker... lecturing me on how to prevent malware getting uploaded
19:49 < Evilpig_> cocksucker! I found the best way was to delete the ftp account that the asshole in canada had saved to his computer back in 2017 when he got infected with some shit that uploaded all over my god damned site
19:49 < Evilpig_> I have a static website with no way for anyone to upload anything, how about them apples dicknose?!
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20:51 <@Dagmar> redsh: For much the same reason he was trying to use `make config` last night
--- Log closed Thu Jan 24 00:00:50 2019