--- Log opened Fri Feb 09 00:00:34 2018
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06:23 <@Dolemite> mr0ning, be0tches and h0ez!
06:40  * aestetix hugs Dolemite 
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08:41 <@dasunt> So do gov't workers have to come in today?
08:45 < aestetix> maybe one of you can answer this question
08:46 < aestetix> is there a reliable source that's not christopher hitchens about the kissinger bombing of cambodia?
08:46 < aestetix> basically every source I've found is easily answered by kissinger's own account in his autobiography
08:47 <@dasunt> Hitchens strikes me as having a pretty big axe to grind.
08:47 < aestetix> yeah he does
08:47 <@dasunt> Have you tried reddit.com/r/askhistorians ?
08:48 < aestetix> At this point I'm really unimpressed by Hitchens
08:48 < aestetix> with one exception, actually
08:48 < aestetix> his analysis of The Odyssey is really interesting
08:48 < aestetix> I don't really read reddit anymore
08:49 <@dasunt> Some reddits are entertaining.  Some are cesspools.  Askhistorians ain't  bad.
08:49 < aestetix> ok
08:49 < aestetix> also, kissinger's name seems to be a honeypot
08:49 < aestetix> but I've read his account of the Breakfast strikes (the cambodia bombing) and it actually makes logical sense
08:49 < aestetix> at least from a realpolitik perspective
08:50 <@dasunt> I think asking for sources is going to be okay.
08:50 < aestetix> and he also directly addresses basically all the criticism of him on that issue I've come across
08:50 < aestetix> in fact, his book is kind of annoying because of how many damned sources he cites.
08:51 <@dasunt> Citations are good.
08:51 < aestetix> heh
08:51 <@dasunt> Authors that don't cite yet try to upend existing doctrine bug the hell out of me.
08:51 < aestetix> It's like "here are two pages on what I did and the reasons for it, and here are four pages of citations of news articles and politicians who criticized me, and why I disagree with their criticisms"
08:53 < aestetix> I mean my biggest criticism of kissinger right now is that he is very cold and calculating, and doesn't seem to have any empathy.
08:54 < aestetix> but if that is grounds for punishment, half the engineers in the world would be in jail :p
08:59 <@dasunt> I'd look for a rebuttle of Kissinger's rebuttle then.
08:59 <@Evilpig> stupid tier 1 comcrap drones
08:59 <@Evilpig> "okay sir I see some packet loss"
09:00 <@Evilpig> no shit asshole, I started this conversation with i'm getting 10% packet loss after you idiots replaced the hardline here yesterday
09:03 <@Evilpig> stupid motherfucker
09:03 <@Evilpig> "i'll put it in the notes that the onsite tech needs to check the hard line"
09:03 <@Evilpig> so your asshole in a van is gonna bring a bucket truck to check the hardline?
09:03 <@Evilpig> "sir I put it in the notes"
09:03 <@dasunt> I see your problem.  You are relying on Comcast.
09:03 <@Evilpig> fucking MORON
09:09 <@Corydon76> Evilpig: ask for a "sweep tech"
09:10 <@Corydon76> When I had similar problems, I had to get the local sweep tech out, and he found a malfunctioning repeater up the street from me
09:11 <@Corydon76> They replaced the repeater, and I had no more problems the rest of the time I lived there
09:11 <@dasunt> Shiboleet:  https://xkcd.com/806/
09:11 < PigBot> xkcd: Tech Support (at xkcd.com) http://tinyurl.com/n6wzk5x
09:14 <@Mirage> hrm..someone just tried to call me from Vandy.
09:15 <@Corydon76> Or a scammer who figured out that CallerIDs from public universities are more likely to be answered
09:16 <@dasunt> The scammers aren't answering when I pick up.
09:16 <@dasunt> I get random out of area numbers.
09:18 <@Evilpig> Corydon76: I'm sure the issue here is in this box at the top of the hill from me where they tied in these new hard lines yesterday
09:19 <@Dagmar> ANyone know what spectacular blowout might have happened to a Unix shop in Franklin?
09:20 <@Dagmar> I just got a call from a recruiter talkign about a place that apparently had their entire unix team walk out
09:20 <@Dagmar> MIght be useful to have a scoop on WTF I may be walking into
09:21 <@Evilpig> ouch.  haven't heard anyhing
09:21 <@Evilpig> then again i'm not overly social these days either
09:25 <@Mirage> Corydon76: it was the outgoing trunkline number
09:26 <@dasunt> Dagmar: Do you want to take that job?
09:26 <@dasunt> Entire team walking out is one hell of a red flag.
09:28 <@Evilpig> could also be a nice payday
09:36 <@Dolemite> It's certainly a bargaining point
09:37 <@Corydon76> It is a red flag, unless the entire team at that point was a single person
09:37 <@dasunt> Definitely get every promise in writing.
09:38 <@dasunt> If you did agree to help them, I'd say the default assumption should be that they are assholes who take advantage of their workers.
09:39 < aestetix> so uh
09:39 < aestetix> Evilpig: at one point I did phone support for Comcast
09:40 < aestetix> let's just say that if they manage to help you at all, you should thank your lucky stars
09:41 < aestetix> the general routine I'd do would be to have them restart their modem, and if that didn't fix it" send a technician
09:41 < aestetix> for absolutely every issue
09:42 < aestetix> even if it was unrelated, like their browser was set to use a proxy or some nonsense
09:42 < aestetix> then the technician would go out, tell them it was an issue with their computer, not the hardware, and they'd call in again and get someone else
09:42 < aestetix> and then I didn't have to think about it again :p
09:43 <@Dagmar> Well, they apparently have a few hundred servers and several hundred virtualized servers so... This being a two-month contract, my attitude is... "I could use the money"
09:43 <@Dagmar> The drive down to Franklin will be kind of a bitch, but if I didn't set Scott Hogan on fire, I can put up with a lot of shit for more than two montsh
09:44 <@Dagmar> ...and frankly since they're in a bind they'll probably pay better than Vanderbilt did
09:45 <@Dagmar> If they come at me with something below 40k/year rates for the gig I may have to get out the calculator and make a judgement call tho
09:45 <@Corydon76> If they're accustomed to screwing over their workers, though, they may promise the moon and then not deliver
09:45 <@Dagmar> Any extra nickels I can save now will probably be worth fifteen cents in about six months
09:45 <@Dagmar> It'll be an hourly contract gig
09:46 <@Dagmar> I've definitely a concern about the red flag, but it could also be that they'd accumulated so many inceompetents someone finally just lost their cool
09:46 <@Dagmar> It could also be an opportunity, because I kick way more ass in person than I do on paper
09:47 <@Dagmar> I've never done a contract gig where someone wasn't wringing their hands about not being able to keep me around
09:52 <@dasunt> $40k/year for contracting work?
09:52 <@dasunt> Unix contracting work?
09:52 <@dasunt> Jebus, just how bad is the economy down there?
10:05 <@Corydon76> Good question.  My base consulting rate comes out around $300k
10:05 <@Corydon76> And that's just "Consulting", not even programming
10:09 <@Dagmar> You'd be shocked at some of the low-ball offers I've seen
10:09 <@Dagmar> Like, Dollar General had offers for admins in Craigslist for quite some time advertising $30-35k for unix adminstrators, so predictably they hired literally no one that way
10:10 <@Dagmar> That was ongoing while I was making more than that working in Vanderbilt's NOC
10:11 <@Corydon76> That might work if unemployment is high, and something is better than nothing.
10:12 <@Corydon76> But with unemployment near record lows, you're right; nobody is going to take them up on that offer for more than a stopgap intermediary position
10:12 <@Dagmar> The fact that it's short-term and money is tight is the only reason I'm willing to sound interested in this gig in light of the giant red flag having an entire department of what was probably at least 8-10 people walk out
10:13 <@Corydon76> I'd honestly be surprised if it was a genuine walk out.  Coordinated efforts like that are virtually unheard of
10:13 <@Dagmar> It's possible I might even be able to convince some people to fix whatever was going that wrong in the first place
10:13 <@Corydon76> More likely, Hatchet Joe decided they spent too much for payroll and slashed the entire department at once
10:13 <@Dagmar> Who knows, maybe they got eaten up with middle managers convinced that Agile is the key to the future and that stand-ups every hour were a great idea
10:14 <@Corydon76> And then they realized, oh shit, those people actually perform useful work
10:14 <@Dagmar> Personally, I'm not really bothered by the idea that I might have to figure out a whole slew of things as I go along
10:14 <@Dagmar> I am the thing mommy bugs tell baby bugs about to get them to go to sleep at night after all
10:15 <@Dagmar> "What I do have is a particular set of skills, and I will use them to find you" and all that
10:38 <@dasunt> Corydon76: We had temp agencies around here telling the Superbowl people they wouldn't even try for under $14/hr for unskilled labor.
10:39 <@dasunt> Unemployment is low.  And our housing costs are high.
10:41 <@Mirage> wow..new puppet module that a customer recently introduced installs gcc, cpp, make, etc onto production hosts.   I sure hope they aren't public facing.
10:42  * Mirage waves a big red flag 
10:43 <@dasunt> Thinking of the skript kiddies.  How nice.
10:43 < dfused> they prolly should make sure nmap is on there too
11:02 <@dasunt> "If, and I mean IF, site 333 is open after slogging through, then making the effort will have saved two portages at the expense of a nasty, muddy haul.  This trail runs almost an entire half-mile thorugh a literal swamp..."
11:02 <@dasunt> LOL.
11:04 <@dasunt> (Yes, there's a site with portage reviews.)
11:30 <@Dolemite> Evilpig: I'm surprised that your issues with Comcast haven't gotten you to move.
11:31 <@Dagmar> He's in an area that should be on the shortlist for Googly Fiber, if they can ever get AT&T and Comcast to stop interfering
11:35 <@Corydon76> Does VMWare ever misbehave as to Linux network interface detection order?  I've not seen it, but we're trying to predict how a machine is going to behave.
11:36 <@Dagmar> It *shouldn't*
11:37 <@Dagmar> If you know the MAC addresses no one's going to fault you for pinning them to specific (and unique) device names
11:37 <@Corydon76> I know that's the way to fix it; just not sure whether it's necessary
11:38 <@Dagmar> Between the vmdk files and Linux's penchant for enumeration in a predictable fashion it should not be a big problem
11:39 <@Corydon76> Where I've seen the reversal of detection in machines is where we have 2 interfaces using exactly the same driver.
11:39 <@Corydon76> Different drivers seem to always detect in the same order
11:40 <@Dagmar> They're supposedly enumerated in the order they appear on their respective busses now
11:40 <@Dagmar> THat was something that got changed to be far less unpredictable some years back
11:40 <@Dagmar> ...just about the same time people started realizing they needed an automatically-generated udev rule for ethernet devices to also keep them from shifting around
11:42 <@Evilpig> Dagmar is correct.  and google fiber is across the street from mckays so it is right here, just not right where I fucking need it
11:47 <@Dagmar> I watched them plant much of that
11:47 <@Dagmar> That they've been unable to actually turn much of any of it on because of Comcast and AT&T should be criminal
12:31 <@Evilpig> from the graph is looks like someone just fixed something
12:57 <@Mirage> lies!
13:24  * dasunt ponders his  banking app.
13:24 <@dasunt> Oh, it's broken.  Yay!
13:24 <@dasunt> That's why I can't log in.
13:41 <@Mirage> Corydon76: If it's a system w/o udev then potentially the vNICs can can up in a different order with respect to the OS.  Most of the time using the MAC in the network config negates any issues, but if someone is an asshat and only used device names (eth0/1, etc) then bad things can potentially happen.
13:43 <@Mirage> Corydon76: which is to say, just like any physical host
15:34 <@Mirage> https://weather.com/science/nature/video/water-is-gushing-from-an-old-tree-in-montenegro-heres-why
15:34 < PigBot> Water is Gushing from an Old Tree in Montenegro, Here's Why | The Weather Channel (at weather.com) http://tinyurl.com/yws3kur
15:49 <@dasunt> Answer:  Jebus.
18:20 <@_NSAKEY> Dagmar: Sounds similar to my previous job. They've bled out all of the high performers in my old department.
18:21 <@_NSAKEY> We were more like NOC+ at that place, since they didn't want to hire "real" admins.
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--- Log closed Sat Feb 10 00:00:35 2018