--- Log opened Tue Sep 05 00:00:16 2017
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05:15 < aestetix> oddball: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=505wFBnGIkg
05:15 < PigBot> Title: GOOGLE/YOUTUBE CENSORSHIP GOES TOO FAR - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) http://tinyurl.com/yb9z9sem
06:31 <@Dolemite> mr0ning, be0tches and h0ez!
06:35  * aestetix hugs Dolemite 
06:41 < aestetix> https://twitter.com/pixelatedboat/status/904883299318808576
06:41 < aestetix> this is fucking hilarious
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07:45 <@oddball> aestetix: About the youtube vid: bwahahahahaha
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08:56 < K`Tetch_> oww, I hurt ALL OVER
08:58 <@oddball> I hope you had fun getting there.
09:14 < K`Tetch_> I don't know
09:14 < K`Tetch_> I thnk I was asleep half the time, but doing things
09:36 < aestetix> Anyone know of a good talk or essay on the politics behind ICANN?
09:37 < aestetix> I'm also curious if domain registrars have removed anyone else before. I know I keep getting those bullshit WHOIS verification emails that I ignore
09:40 <@dasunt> Never heard of Google Fuchsia before.
09:41 < aestetix> neither have I
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09:42 <@dasunt> Wonder what Google plans are.
09:42 <@dasunt> Android replacement?  Or?
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10:16 <@brimstone> that's the rumor
10:16 <@brimstone> it breaks google of the linux kernel and those problems
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10:58 <@dasunt> I'm reading about Masterpiece Cakes, Ltd vs Colorado Civil Rights Commission.
10:58 <@dasunt> (It's the company that's arguing that baking a cake for a gay couple is violating their religious belief)
10:58 <@dasunt> Here's what I don't get - it's a company.  Presumably a limited liability company.  It's set up to be separate from the owner's assets.
10:59 <@dasunt> Why does the owner get to argue that his company has a religious belief?
11:22 <@brimstone> companies are people too
11:23 <@brimstone> surely chic-fil-a has some ruling against the gays
12:10 <@dasunt> How?
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12:10 <@dasunt> Seriously, how does a company, operating as a separate entity, have a religious affiliation?
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12:28 < aestetix> dasunt: citizens united, maybe?
--- Log closed Tue Sep 05 12:34:53 2017
--- Log opened Tue Sep 05 12:45:32 2017
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12:50 <@Dagmar> dasunt: Because it's being used to absorb the repercussions of moral responsibility
12:51 <@Dagmar> dasunt: Such claims are _exactly_ how corporations are used to separate monetary concerns from ethical concerns, and simply ignore ethics and morailty.
12:51 < aestetix> dasunt: got a link to the case?
12:51 < aestetix> I'd actually be interested in reading it
12:52 <@Dagmar> It fortunately doesn't protect a company from being sued for doing dickbag things
12:52 <@Dagmar> It only protects the people who decided on the dickbag behaviour from having the blame for that follow them home
12:53 < aestetix> well I mean, can you force a jewish bakery to bake a swastika cake?
12:53 < aestetix> I think they'd have a damned good reason to say "fuck you"
12:53 <@Dagmar> Of course
12:54 <@Dagmar> ...and should Chick-Fil-A be asked to cater to a homosexual orgy, they could object
12:55 <@Dagmar> Refusing to deliver an otherwise completely boring cake to people just because they're gay is discrimination
12:55 < aestetix> What if the jewish bakery refused to serve a normal boring cake to a neo-nazi?
12:55 <@Dagmar> There's a real easy test for this.  If you can replace the word "gay" or whatever the objection was with "black" and it's obvious that they're racist assholes, what they're doing is discriminatory
12:56 < aestetix> like Richard Spencer or something
12:56 <@Dagmar> I doubt they'd much care
12:56 <@Dagmar> Rabbis lead the field in being reasonable
12:56 <@Dagmar> It's almost like their religion values rational thought and intelligent discourse
13:33 <@dasunt> aestetix: Just google the case I named, it's going up to the supreme court.
13:34 <@dasunt> I just find it odd, that if I (say) tripped and fell, shattering my hip, I couldn't go after the owner's assets, but just the assets of the business entity.
13:34 <@dasunt> Yet when it comes to making a cake for a gay wedding, all of a sudden the owner's beliefs come into play.
13:36 <@dasunt> How far does this go?
13:36 <@dasunt> Like, if I'm an owner, can I violate the law by not hiring women if my religious belief says that women shouldn't work outside of the home?
13:37 <@cordless> slippery slope
13:37 <@cordless> just like that hobby lobby bullshit about birth control
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14:04 < xray> Substitute Trump supporter for black. Restaurants refused to serve Trump supporters during the election.
14:05 < xray> Can't have your cake and eat it too. (no pun inended)
14:06 < aestetix> xray: wow, are you serious?
14:06 < xray> Yes it actually happened during the elction.
14:06 < aestetix> reminds me of an article I just saw
14:07 < aestetix> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-09-05/the-lonely-lives-of-silicon-valley-conservatives
14:07 < PigBot> Title: The Lonely Lives of Silicon Valley Conservatives - Bloomberg (at www.bloomberg.com) http://tinyurl.com/ycz8jj7s
14:07 < xray> If a business refuses service to someone with no shirt is that discriminating against poor people?
14:07 < aestetix> I don't think being poor is a legally protected class
14:07 < aestetix> therein lies the issue
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14:08 < xray> Really. Then what logic did they use to turn over voter ID laws.
14:09 < xray> It discriminated against the poor who couldn't get to the DMV to get a free ID card.
14:09 < aestetix> Not arguing with you.
14:10 < xray> We also discriminate against felons. They lose the right to vote.
14:10 < xray> Discrimination is not always bad.
14:10 < aestetix> That's a state level thing.
14:10 < aestetix> You also discriminate against those you don't hire when you hire someone.
14:11 < K`Tetch_> is felons losing the rght to vote a good thing?
14:11 < xray> I discriminate against eating poisons too.
14:11 < aestetix> K`Tetch_: no
14:11 < aestetix> Then again the US has shown time and time again they don't actually care about reform
14:11 < aestetix> Otherwise you wouldn't have to report that you are a convicted felon in an unrelated area
14:12 < aestetix> IE if you are a felon for abusing children, you shouldn't work in a school
14:12 < xray> The point is that there is discrimination and then there is discrimination.
14:12 < aestetix> xray: agreed
14:13 < xray> the problem is calling a person a racist when it is not appropriate just muddies the waters and makes it impossible to actually discuss the underlying issues.
14:13 < aestetix> yep
14:13 < aestetix> one of the reasons political discourse in the US has gone to total shit
14:13 < xray> If I declare you a racist, I win the argument by default, even if the charge is unfounded.
14:15 < xray> Reminds me of  Fezzic in The Princess Bride. I don't think that word means what you think it means.
14:15 < aestetix> well it's sort of like how everyone that disagrees with you is a nazi
14:15 < xray> Exactly but I was trying to avoid Godwins Law
14:15 < aestetix> lol
14:16 <@Dagmar> New plan for dealing with spoof-calling spammers
14:16 < xray> So now that you said that we have to change the subject or we violate some thing in the ether
14:16 < xray> Really? What would that be.
14:17 <@Dagmar> "Oh geez thank goodness I was able to get through the ACD.  Look, the authorities are going to be there in about 10 minutes with a warrant to arrest _everybody_.  You need to clear the heck out of there right now.  Gotta go."
14:17 < xray> What is ACD?
14:18 <@Dagmar> "No, don't wait.  Grab anything personally identifiable off your workstation and get far away right now."
14:18 <@Dagmar> Automatic Call Distributor
14:18 < xray> Ah
14:18 < xray> That is really funny. Turn the social engineering against them.
14:19 <@Dagmar> I am escalating to Stage Two of dealing with them.  "Inciting panic"
14:19 <@Dagmar> It worked pretty well on the place that was calling me from California
14:20 < xray> Let us know if it works. Then again how would you know.
14:20 <@Dagmar> Still working out what phrase I need to use to the people in Inida
14:20 <@Dagmar> The California people called me three times in as many weeks
14:20 <@Dagmar> No calls for two months now
14:20 < xray> What about using Jolly Roger telephone
14:20 < xray> http://www.jollyrogertelco.com/
14:20 < PigBot> Title: Jolly Roger Telephone Company, saving the world from bad telemarketing (at www.jollyrogertelco.com) http://tinyurl.com/hpqvcyj
14:21 < xray> The creator did a TED talk. It was very funny.
14:21 < xray> Really irritated the callers
14:21 <@Dagmar> I prefer the personal touch
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14:46 <@dasunt> xray: AFAIK, a store can refuse to serve you for the most trivial of reasons, as long as it doesn't fall under a protected class of people.
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