--- Log opened Wed Mar 29 00:00:51 2017
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01:59 < aestetix> ok this makes me sad
01:59 < aestetix> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13981729
02:00 < PigBot> Title: Before getting all spun up, Id dig a little deeper on the issue than what the W... | Hacker News (at news.ycombinator.com) http://tinyurl.com/lxxcdyx
02:00 < aestetix> comments on the WAPO reporting on the FCC ruling on internet
02:00 < aestetix> If this is correct, it's stuff like this that has made everyone lose faith in "media"
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04:16 < aestetix> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDX3GqwV5r0
04:16 < PigBot> Title: CNN panelists spar over Sean Spicer comment - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) http://tinyurl.com/n2vobd7
04:16 < aestetix> in which CNN is indistinguishable from Jerry Springer
06:33 < _NSAKEY> aestetix: The FCC also classified ISPs away from the Title II regs in the mid-2006s.
06:33 < _NSAKEY> I forget the guy's name off-hand, but he was Bush's FCC chairman.
06:34 < _NSAKEY> ISPs became "internet services" after that, and the war against net neutrality began.
06:34 < _NSAKEY> The part about the recently scuttled privacy regulations is 100% true, though.
06:36 < _NSAKEY> But to claim that the FCC putting ISPs back under Title II is somehow "overreach" when the FCC is the governing body that previously reclassified them is, in a word, bullshit.
06:36 < aestetix> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fN7V4AH4GEs
06:36 < PigBot> Title: Brexit Live: Triggering Article 50 (House Of Commons) - BBC News - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) http://tinyurl.com/k95a4t2
06:36 < _NSAKEY> It's all politics, largely along party lines.
06:39 <@Dolemite> mr0ning, be0tches and h0ez!
06:42  * aestetix hugs Dolemite 
06:56 < xray> https://www.gofundme.com/crunch-medical-fund?r=42935
06:56 < PigBot> Title: Crunch Medical Fund by John T. Draper - GoFundMe (at www.gofundme.com) http://tinyurl.com/mgkv2lv
07:01 < xray> Captain Crunch started phone phreaking
07:04 <@Dolemite> I met him back on the Delphi Information Service in the 1980s.
07:04 <@Dolemite> Friend of mine worked with him in LA
07:05 <@Dolemite> We are all geatting old. :(
07:05 < _NSAKEY> xray: I think that honor goes to Joybubbles, but Crunch certainly brought it from the circle of blind kids in the 50s.
07:07 < xray> I heard about it via Crunch back in the early 70s. Not directly but by word of mouth. I even had a Captain Crunch whistle.
07:07 < _NSAKEY> There were some blind kids with perfect pitch who figured it out before him, but I think he was one of the first people with sight who did it.
07:08 < xray> I hadn't heard of Joybubbles. Thanks for the link. There's a wikipedia page.
07:08 <@Dolemite> NPR had some good stories on him a few years back
07:08 <@Dolemite> him being Joybubbles
07:21 < aestetix> I don't know if it's true, but I also recall a story that Crunch introduced Steve Jobs to computers
07:21 < dfused> Captain Crunch?
07:21 < aestetix> yes
07:22 < dfused> damn cutting the roof of my mouth
07:22 < aestetix> also fuck american health insurance
07:22 < aestetix> If he were in Germany this would all just be covered
07:23  * dfused slowly sips his coffee waiting for the text on his screen to unblur...
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08:17 < _NSAKEY> aestetix: Haven't heard that one before, but Jobs and Wozniak did encounter Captain Crunch, and did sell blue boxes before moving to computers.
08:17 < _NSAKEY> I always thought it was funny that they got their start ripping off Ma Bell, then decades later Apple released the iPhone as an AT&T exclusive.
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08:49 < frsilent> aestetix: agreed; it's so awful
08:49 < frsilent> just got a bill for the remaining balance on an MRI... they charged $4175 to my insurance company
08:49 < frsilent> nearly double the average cost
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09:01 <@Dagmar> Don't worry.  The insurance company will only pay about half of that.
09:01 < aestetix> jesus
09:01 < aestetix> that's insane
09:02 < frsilent> yep, remaining balance is nearly $2k
09:02 < frsilent> my company is kind enough to pay me an extra $150/mo for insurance reimbursement....
09:03 <@Dagmar> But wait... was your insurance supposed to cover all of it?
09:03 < frsilent> the nurse fucked up the iv for the coloring agent 3x too; not sure where she was trained but I've definitely given myself an IV better than that
09:03 < frsilent> Dagmar: no $2500 deductible & I believe they covered ~$2300
09:03 <@Dagmar> They're kind of famous for deciding that "negotiating better prices for their customers" is what it's called when they simply refuse to pay an entire bill
09:04 <@Dagmar> Like, they _literally_ will only pay 40 cents on the dollar to doctors
09:04 < frsilent> I was stupid and went to the imaging company that my PCP referred me to instead of shopping around for something better
09:04 < frsilent> stupid/ignorant
09:04 <@Dagmar> OUch
09:05 < frsilent> $2k life lesson learned (silver lining)
09:07 < aestetix> frsilent: thank god the media is covering bathroom politics instead of health care issues
09:08 < frsilent> the important things :|
09:09 <@Corydon76> It's relevant in North Carolina, where their obstinance is about to cost the state a couple billion dollars
09:10 < aestetix> Corydon76: I have no issue with that being discussed in North Carolina
09:10 < aestetix> The problem is when the national media sets aside important stories to cover it
09:10 < frsilent> agreed
09:11 <@Corydon76> And then there's the Tennessee legislature, which is saying, "Hey it's no fair only North Carolina gets to ruin its economy; we want in on that action."
09:12 <@Corydon76> Repeat a dozen times across the country, and you've got a national story, where state legislators are refusing to learn from the mistakes of their brethren
09:13 <@Corydon76> Oh, and don't worry.  House Republicans are eager to try again on the health care bill, because what's one failure?  They want to be known as the party of multiple failures.
09:14 < aestetix> Which is hardly worse than the Democrats coming out against Sean Spicer for "sexism" on that reporter
09:15 < aestetix> What's funny is that if the democrats just focused on the actual things the republicans are doing, they would have more than enough fail to cover
09:15 < aestetix> But they insist on ignoring the fail, and making up fake stories about fail
09:15 <@Corydon76> Which is why we need fresh people in Congress.  You running in 2018?
09:16 < aestetix> Corydon76: I thought jonnyx was on the ballet
09:16 < aestetix> ballot
09:16 <@Corydon76> He may indeed be in the ballet.  They're always looking for people out of their realm to star in The Nutcracker.
09:17 < aestetix> haha
09:17 < aestetix> But that's what I don't get about the democrats.
09:17 < aestetix> They have the biggest GOP fuckup in 50 years handed to them, and they still insist on the identity politics nonsense.
09:17 <@Corydon76> Nashville Ballet keeps putting pro football players in their productions
09:18 <@Corydon76> I don't think the Democrats are insisting on that.  It's that the national media picks the most interesting story, and there's always one crackpot focusing on the wrong thing
09:18 < aestetix> Then why did Hillary Clinton make a statement about the press conference "drama"?
09:19 < aestetix> Obama has been smart enough to sit all this stuff out and apparently surf the waves
09:20 < aestetix> But seriously. The media is doing a shit job, as you just stated. Sean Spicer points this out, and instead of addressing this, the democrats immediately call him sexist.
09:21 < aestetix> Hillary could have made a statement about Trump's Russia dealings, which really do need more attention.
09:21 < aestetix> Instead, "you're sexist"
09:21 <@Corydon76> Yes, but Sean Spicer thinks the media is doing a shit job, because they're covering things that make the Administration look bad.  He could care less about minor distractions, as long as they don't involve the Trump White House
09:22 <@Corydon76> Spicer is pissed off at the half of the media which is doing its job, not the half of the media which is doing a terrible job
09:22 < aestetix> I don't think its 50/50. I think it's maybe 90/10. And that 10% is basically PBS and one or two others
09:23 < aestetix> As evidenced by the CNN video I linked earlier.
09:23 < aestetix> Or the WaPo article about the FCC stuff.
09:23 <@Corydon76> I couldn't really give a crap about what the percentages are, which is why I went for 50/50
09:24 < aestetix> My point is that the absolutely overwhelming majority of media is shit.
09:25 < aestetix> That said
09:25 < aestetix> This discussion alone is actually useful.
09:25 < aestetix> Like if Hillary had commented on this issue, and not "sexism", that would have been great, although a bit annoying
09:25 < aestetix> since she is the last person I want to hear from right now
09:26 < aestetix> actually no. trump is
09:26 <@rhia> conservatives are good at staying on message, repeating a point ad nauseum until people just accept the BS as true, when liberals attempt to call BS, conservatives wave their keys and liberals fall for the shiny every.fricking.time.
09:26 < aestetix> rhia: yep
09:40 < aestetix> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tc4ROCJYbm0
09:40 < PigBot> Title: AT Archives: The UNIX Operating System - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) http://tinyurl.com/9yr94ta
09:55 <@dasunt> rhia: Liberals also seem to have the attention span of goldfish.
09:58 <@Corydon76> dasunt: so it's your position that Trump is a liberal, then?  Because that decently describes his attention span.
09:59 <@dasunt> Corydon76: A dog has four legs.  Doesn't mean the small creature with pointy ears and says "meow" a lot is a dog.
09:59 < aestetix> Corydon76: he was a registered democrat at least twice
09:59 < aestetix> I think he's changed party affiliations like six times
09:59 <@Corydon76> Yes, but Democrat != liberal
10:00 < aestetix> this is true
10:00 <@Corydon76> There are liberal Republicans and conservative Democrats
10:00 <@dasunt> Maybe Trum'
10:00 <@dasunt> Maybe Trump's strength is that he can fuel the liberal flash-outrage machine.
10:01 <@Corydon76> Hanlon's Razor applies here
10:02 <@rhia> Trump isn't a liberal or a conservative, he's his own ideology, his own reality.
10:02 <@Corydon76> He's a populist in rhetoric and an egotist in governance.
10:03 <@Corydon76> I wouldn't be half surprised if the newly formed Trump Construction Company gets the contract to build the wall.
10:04 <@dasunt> Neither would I, TBH.
10:04 <@Dagmar> He's rather ideally qualified as a president to be impeached for Treason
10:04 < aestetix> .... newly formed Trump Construction Company?
10:04 <@dasunt> Nor would I be surprised if Trump was shocked that other people had a problem with this.
10:04 < aestetix> ok see this is my issue
10:04 < aestetix> the media should be all over that
10:04 <@rhia> I wouldn't be surprised if his wall turns out to be giant letters T R U M P held together by chainlink
10:05 <@Corydon76> Dagmar: treason is yet a bridge too far.  He might be 25th out for incompetence
10:05 < dfused> Trump Const Co needs to be in charge of the wall building so that it will be managed properly... -rolls eyes-
10:05 <@Dagmar> Corydon76: I suspect it's only a matter of time at this point
10:06 <@Dagmar> Like, _some_ of the pieces of that puzzle are just too large and obvious
10:06 <@rhia> dfused, very true, but you have to remember that " managed properly" means to direct the profits to Trump family accounts
10:06 <@Corydon76> You mean like how his campaign manager was being paid by the Russians during the campaign?
10:06 <@Dagmar> An offer "made in gest" some time ago to give him X% of Giant Ass Russian Oil Company...
10:06 < aestetix> dfused: you mean so it will funnel money from the treasury to trump's bank account without leaking
10:06 < dfused> aestetix: yes.... "managed"
10:07 <@Dagmar> ...and then right as he's elected, almost exactly X% of said Giant Ass Russian Oil Company sort of gets buried under dummy companies and blinds
10:07 <@Dagmar> s/gest/jest/
10:07 <@Corydon76> I made the point early on that Trump looked like the Manchurian Candidate
10:07 <@Dagmar> There's a prohibition on self-enrichment that _by itself_ will probably get his ass impeached
10:08 <@Corydon76> Dagmar:  high crime, yes.  Treason, no.  Treason still requires direct evidence of colluding with an Enemy of the United States
10:08 < aestetix> So didn't he put Ivanka in charge of the Trump Corporation?
10:08 <@Corydon76> and an "overt act" with witnesses
10:08 <@Dagmar> ...but this stuff about him spending the same as some departments entire operating budgets just to play golf?  That's the sort of thing that'll get him _firebombed_ out of office eventually
10:08 < aestetix> IE that was why Jared Kushner being in the white house was such a big deal, because they are married
10:09 < aestetix> And then somehow it turned into Ivanka getting a security clearance
10:09 < aestetix> I guess Donald is happy to leave the company with his kids, Beavis and Butthead
10:09 <@dasunt> Remember, if we lose Trump, we get Pence.
10:10 <@dasunt> Pence, the complete conservative Christian asshole.
10:10 <@Corydon76> I rather suspect Trump will throw Pence under the bus in order to save his own hide
10:10 < aestetix> I wonder if Trump will order money to start bearing his name
10:10 <@dasunt> I hope Trump throws the whole GOP under the bus to save his hide.
10:11 <@Corydon76> Or, in other words, Trump will agnew Pence
10:11 <@dasunt> But as much as it pains me, I'll take President Trump over President Pence.
10:11 < aestetix> dasunt: if he tossed in toe DNC too, that would be great
10:11 <@dasunt> aestetix: DNC is too busy doubling down on the politics of failure at this point to be involved.
10:11 <@Corydon76> Given the chairman just gutted the DNC, that's not necessary
10:12 <@dasunt> They should have gone with Keith Ellison instead of Tom Perez.
10:13 <@dasunt> I suspect Perez's firings are just an example of "we must do something so let's do something".
10:17 <@Corydon76> Selecting Keith Ellison at this point would be like nominating Carter in 1980.  Sure, he appeals to the base of the party, but he won't appeal to middle America.
10:18 <@dasunt> I disagree.
10:19 < aestetix> Well at the moment Trump has a decent chance in 2020 because everyone else sucks.
10:19 < aestetix> Which is scary.
10:19 <@Corydon76> Each faction in America takes somewhere between 10 and 20% of the electorate.  You need not just the liberals to win an election in all but the most liberal districts
10:20 <@Corydon76> Each party has approximately 40% of the electorate sewn up.  It's that middle 20% which decides elections.  So do you go with the extreme left or right, or do you try to appeal to the center?
10:21 <@dasunt> Well, in 2016, Trump went extreme right, Hillary went for the center.
10:21 < aestetix> Corydon76: if everyone sucks, then you just stick with what you have
10:21 <@Corydon76> Hillary also lost one of her segments that typically goes for the Democrats:  labor
10:21 < aestetix> For good reason
10:21 <@dasunt> What part of Keith Ellison's philosophy doesn't appeal to the center?
10:22 <@Corydon76> Labor was what lost Clinton Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Michigan
10:22 <@Corydon76> http://www.ontheissues.org/House/Keith_Ellison_Gun_Control.htm
10:22 < PigBot> Corydon76: That URL appears to have no HTML title.
10:23 <@Corydon76> That right there pisses off middle America.
10:23 <@dasunt> Corydon76: Dems have gone on about that for years.
10:23 <@Corydon76> It's one of the few issues that if Democrats would stop with the useless legislation, they'd win a good portion of middle America
10:25 <@Corydon76> The problem is, they won't, because it's generally a 50/50 issue that polls well on the coasts
10:26 < aestetix> what kind of useless legislation
10:26 <@Corydon76> How about the large capacity ammo bans?
10:26 < aestetix> ok yea
10:26 <@dasunt> Do realize that Ellison is from flyover country.
10:26 <@Corydon76> How about the attempted repeal of Stand Your Ground laws
10:27 < aestetix> You mean the useless laws that make it look like they are taking a stand against a perceived evil
10:27 < aestetix> And usually also hurts law abiding citizens in the process
10:28 <@dasunt> DNC should just drop the whole gun issue.
10:28 <@Corydon76> dasunt: where he's from is irrelevant.  His record is relevant
10:28 <@rattle> So much for broadband privacy.  That whole idea of ISPs not being able to sell information about your network usage is dead now.
10:28 <@Corydon76> rattle: and that right there is an example of a winning issue
10:29 <@Corydon76> Americans generally don't want this idea of corporations spying on you
10:29 <@rattle> https://github.com/trailofbits/algo/blob/master/README.md
10:29 < PigBot> Title: algo/README.md at master · trailofbits/algo · GitHub (at github.com) http://tinyurl.com/kavq7op
10:29 <@rattle> Oh, this is going to be a political shit storm.
10:30 <@rattle> I've been getting questions about it all day.
10:31 < aestetix> rattle: why?
10:31 < aestetix> I assume the FCC thing, but ansible is really technical
10:31 <@Corydon76> dasunt: to continue the fact that the record matters, here's Tom Perez on gun control:  http://www.ontheissues.org/Cabinet/Thomas_Perez_Gun_Control.htm
10:31 < PigBot> Corydon76: That URL appears to have no HTML title.
10:33 <@rattle> Well, folks I've talked to are in the know enough to realize that Google and other services they use gather and use their private information to sell ads and whatnot already..  But that they have a choice to use those service or not.
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10:33 <@rattle> But, are flummoxed that their ISP now has carte blanch to do it for all their internet usage, and they don't really have any choices in the matter.
10:33 < aestetix> rattle: are they the same people who raised a shitstorm over the NSA stuff but have been silent about Axciom?
10:45 < grimwar> sure wish someone would set up a se2600 vpn :)
10:47 <@Corydon76> Yes, because all of us produce such great content that cannot be secured simply with HTTPS.
10:48 < grimwar> not about the content, it's about the activity. general surfing activity being sold for targeted ads.
10:49 <@Corydon76> And if the sites you're surfing are all secured with HTTPS, how exactly is the ISP going to benefit?
10:50 < grimwar> ??
10:51 < grimwar> they can sell that information to advertisers, they can create ad networks to target you, your information can be sold to the highest bidder
10:51 < xray> collusion on the backed with the site owners
10:51 < xray> that's what browser finger printing is for
10:51 <@Corydon76> The whole idea is that they're collecting your information.  If everything you're doing is already encrypted, how exactly are they going to collect information about your surfing habits?
10:51 < grimwar> a dns lookup isn't encrypted
10:52 < xray> also meta data is very useful
10:52 <@Corydon76> They can already do that.  There is no restriction on ISPs buying back the information from site owners
10:52 < grimwar> yeah but they are buying that, not gathering it from 100% of users without opt-out
10:53 <@Corydon76> I'll grant that the metadata of DNS lookups is useful, in a somewhat general sense
10:53 < xray> First rule of OPSEC: The environment is hostile.
10:53 <@Corydon76> They can tell you went to Amazon.  But they won't be able to tell what you browsed at Amazon
10:53 < xray> 2nd rule: trust no one
10:53 <@Corydon76> So, DNSSEC
10:53 < grimwar> yeah but they can also tell you went to cureherpes.com etc....
10:54 <@Corydon76> ObiwonShinobi was developing a great tool for polluting that data gathering a couple years ago
10:55 < grimwar> I'm also not concerned as much with my own privacy, I consider myself semi-well informed, I am more concerned with general public and the people who don't get it.
10:55 <@Corydon76> It would randomly do searches and pull pages down, all in an effort to obscure that data collection and give you plausible deniability
10:55 < grimwar> that sounds cool. like a dns fuzzer
10:56 <@Corydon76> He presented it at one of the Nashville 2600 meetings, with an FBI agent in attendance, and the agent was surprised at the effort
10:56 < grimwar> you could always setup a dedicated web crawler and say you are doing web indexing dev
10:57 <@Corydon76> No, the whole point of it was to give the user plausible deniability.  Did they really go to that site, or was it the robot in the background?
10:57 < grimwar> right, like my web crawler just ended up there ....
10:59 <@Corydon76> Well, but a web crawler generally has interconnectivity between all the sites it goes to and the results, so that can be traced and removed
10:59 < grimwar> sure, fair point, maybe that is just a jumping off point.
10:59 <@Corydon76> If you use a tool that is going after random search phrases, you're generating a ton of separate trees
11:00 <@Corydon76> In amongst that forest, what is the real tree of the user?
11:00 < grimwar> yeah but search phrases like "apple sweat resign tumor" is not that useful against "hacktheplanet.com" etc..
11:01 < grimwar> would be hard to get the logic of the random generator right
11:01 <@Corydon76> I can think of ways to get more natural phrasing
11:01 <@Corydon76> Same way the spam bots do it, and the same way that Google itself detects natural language versus lists of keywords when indexing
11:02 < grimwar> you should write it, i'd keep it running just for shits
11:02 <@Corydon76> ObiwonShinobi already wrote it
11:02 < grimwar> oh, didn't realize you said he actually finished
11:02 <@Corydon76> All software can be improved
11:02 < aestetix> except emacs
11:03 <@Corydon76> aestetix: I can improve emacs with the mv command.  Specifically, mv /usr/bin/vim /usr/bin/emacs
11:03 < aestetix> haha
11:03 < frsilent> I was waiting for it
11:03 < xray> emacs is an operating system
11:03 < aestetix> yes
11:04 <@Corydon76> ...but it lacks a decent editor
11:04 < aestetix> improving emacs is like polishing a turd
11:04 < xray> LoL
11:04 < xray> to the editor comment
11:05 <@Corydon76> Not my original, but it's always worth repeating.
11:05 <@Corydon76> "Emacs is a great operating system, but it lacks a decent editor."
11:08 < aestetix> ok. Jetzt gehe ich zuhaus. Bis spaät!
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11:26 <@Mirage> wow, wtf..I can't get to any google page.
11:27 <@Evilpig> did you tweet something bad to trump?
11:27 <@Mirage> lol...me tweet...that's a good one
11:35 <@Mirage> and now it's working.   Gonna guess that there was an issue with their GTM or whatever they use for the DFW local mirror 216.58.218.100.   Two PTR's for it, neither were accessible
11:41 <@Corydon76> Mirage: somebody unplugged a cable in your data center and droppen the token on the floor
11:42 <@Corydon76> Token Ring FTW
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11:58 <@dasunt> I'm trying to be a responsible adult(tm) and not spend four figures on stuff from Craigslist.
11:58  * dasunt doesn't like this adulting.
11:59 <@Corydon76> dasunt: that's better than needing to spend 4 figures at the pharmacy
11:59 <@dasunt> Corydon76: I'm greatful that my health insurance kicks in for that stuff.
12:00 <@dasunt> Sucks that occasionally just for the hell of it they'll deny a prescription until the doctor says "mother may I?", but that's the price of Freedom!
12:00 <@Corydon76> Yeah, for everything except name brand non-preferred medications
12:01 <@Corydon76> Thank goodness for drug discount programs
12:01 <@dasunt> Well who knows better - a beancounter, or your doctor?
12:02 <@dasunt> Remember, in America, death panels are perfectly fine as long as they are privately run.
12:02  * dasunt climbs off his soapbox.
12:02 <@Corydon76> I'm also told the drug my doctor just put me on will have a generic coming out in December of this year
12:02 < dfused> dasunt: lies!
12:03 <@Corydon76> So it'll only cost 5 figures for the first year
12:03 <@dasunt> I'm told that my insurance company approves the drug I need until 2020.
12:04 <@dasunt> Then, presumably, they'll double check to see if the genetic condition I have magically heals itself or something.
12:04 <@Corydon76> First prescription exhausts my annual out-of-pocket maximum
12:04 <@dasunt> Corydon76: On the plus side, that makes the FSA planning easy.
12:05 <@Corydon76> dasunt: Yeah, except that my annual out of pocket maximum is more than what I can put into the MSA annually
12:06  * dasunt sighs.
12:06 <@Corydon76> Or HSA, whatever they call it now
12:06 <@dasunt> HSA is the one that rolls over.
12:06 <@dasunt> FSA is the one where you lose the money at the end of the year.
12:06 <@Corydon76> $3400 versus $4000
12:07 <@dasunt> HSA is only for high deductable plans.  FSA is for regular plans.
12:07 <@Corydon76> Yeah, that.
12:07 <@dasunt> Thinking about it too much makes me want to hoist the red flag of socialism.
12:08 < dfused> at least we'll hve vodka
12:08 < xray> There in lies maddness
12:09 <@dasunt> We're already in madness.
12:09 < xray> many have died, their ship wrecked on the siren rocks of socialism
12:10 <@Corydon76> dasunt: the only saving grace is that the drug manufacturer will pay $3600 of my $4000 annual out of pocket maximum
12:11 <@dasunt> Corydon76: That's actually pretty good - if you are only paying $400/yr for drug costs, that's less than $50/mo.
12:11 <@Corydon76> I'm paying only $400 a year in OOP medical care
12:11 <@Corydon76> That $4,000 is the OOP max for everything in medical care, period
12:11 <@dasunt> Nice.
12:12 <@Corydon76> Unfortunately, dental care is separate, though
12:12 <@Corydon76> Oh, and only in-network.
12:12 <@Corydon76> If I go out of network, I'd have an $8,000 OOP max
12:13 <@Corydon76> Oh, and the OOP max is also my deductible
12:16 < aestetix> god
12:16 < aestetix> I am so glad I don't have to deal with that shit anymore
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15:23 <@dasunt> Today's "oh shit, I should have known that" - Dutch is spoken in more than just the Netherlands.
15:25 <@Corydon76> Right, because the Dutch were just as active in conquering and colonizing the New World as the British or Portuguese.
15:25 < dfused> This just in:   English is spoken in more than just America and England
15:25 <@dasunt> Corydon76: I was speaking of Flanders.
15:26 <@Corydon76> dasunt: you need to be a bit more expansive than that.
15:27 <@dasunt> Corydon76: Dutch is spoken in the northern half of Belgium, which is known as Flanders.
15:28 <@dasunt> The more I learn about Europe, the more it sounds like it's just made up.
15:29 <@Corydon76> dasunt: I believe it's a mix of Dutch and Belgian, similar to how Switzerland doesn't speak purely German or purely French, but a mix of the two languages.
15:29 <@dasunt> Belgian isn't a language, AFAIK.
15:30 <@Corydon76> It's not an official language, no, same as Swiss German isn't a "real" language, either.
15:30 <@Corydon76> It's a dialect.
15:30 <@dasunt> The inhabitants either speak Dutch (northern half), French (southern half), or German (a few border regions).
15:31 <@Corydon76> Those are the official languages of the regions
15:31 < dfused> the german areas are the only ones that count.  <.<
15:32 <@dasunt> They are like 1% of the country.  :p
15:32 <@Corydon76> But they also speak West Flemish, East Flemish, Brabantian, Limburgish, Walloon, Picard, Champenois, Lorrain, and Low Dietsch.
15:32 < dfused> Corydon76: stop going to wikipedia
15:32 <@Corydon76> lol
15:34 <@Corydon76> Oh, and a pretty sizable portion of the population also speaks English, funnily enough.
15:35 <@dasunt> I think the evidence is clear:  Belgium is a fictional country that's a test of gullibility.
15:36 <@Corydon76> Their keyboards are also laid out in a weird way, obviously to serve as an easy way to identify British spies.
15:38 < dfused> obviously.
15:42 <@dasunt> Seems controversial:  https://bensch.be/azerty-in-flanders
15:42 < PigBot> Title: We Should Not Use Azerty In Flanders. | Jeroen Bensch (at bensch.be) http://tinyurl.com/mlc53d3
16:29 <@Mirage> Evilpig: this makes me think of your Jay ringtone.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTSA_sWGM44
16:29 < PigBot> Title: Trololo... The Full Original Version. - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) http://tinyurl.com/a2ntp22
19:34 <@Catonic> oy
19:42 < dfused> oy vey
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22:14 < aestetix> hi Catonic
22:15 < aestetix> lol
22:15 < aestetix> Corydon76: "sizeable portion" you mean in Belgium or the Netherlands?
22:16 < aestetix> I can say from experience that in Luxembourg *maybe* 10% speak english
22:16 < aestetix> Luxembourgh is probably 80% french speaking and 20% german speaking, at least in luxembourg city
22:18 < aestetix> That whole region between France and Germany is a linguistic clusterfuck :p
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--- Log closed Thu Mar 30 00:00:53 2017