--- Log opened Tue Mar 29 00:00:50 2016
00:23 <@Dagmar> The hell?
00:23 <@Dagmar> We just heard one hell of a boom here
00:24 <@Dagmar> Goodlettesville Area, less than two miles from Rivergate mall
00:25 <@Dagmar> Reminded me of when the transformers were all blowing after an ice storm, so maybe it was that
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06:44 <@Dagmar> Weev is just genuinely not very bright
06:44 < aestetix> He is making sure he'll never be able to come back to the US
06:44 < aestetix> Dagmar: I assume you're referring to his New York Times expose?
06:45 <@Dagmar> I was under the impression he's in the US _now_
06:45 < aestetix> No.
06:45 < aestetix> He's in some country bordering Russia, iirc
06:45 <@Dagmar> He'd better hope they don't have anti-semitism laws then
06:46 < aestetix> I don't think so. He's not in Europe.
06:46 <@Dagmar> ...although at this point I think it would be hilarious if he wound up in something akin to Turkish prison
06:47 <@Dagmar> These weren't webservers he accessed this time
06:48 < aestetix> Nope. They were printers.
06:48 <@Dagmar> His argument that these were "lawful accesses" won't fly according to the USC
06:48 < aestetix> BUT they were readily accessible via the web.
06:48 <@Dagmar> That doesn't matter
06:48 <@Dagmar> That's not the way the code is written
06:48 < aestetix> In this case, it seems more like "well he left his door open, it was easy to just walk inside"
06:49 <@Dagmar> Also, _again_ he did something that would piss people off and incentivize them to throw his ass in jail
06:49 < aestetix> This surprises you?
06:49 <@Dagmar> At this point, not really
06:49 <@Dagmar> This is why I am starting to suspect he's actually just fucking stupid
06:49 < aestetix> I do find it fucking hilarious though
06:52 <@Dagmar> Not funny this time because it wasn't original or interesting
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06:53 < aestetix> It is funny because I also hate the idiot safe space bullshit, and this makes them suffer.
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08:23 < TheDukh_> odd question, but does anyone have a specific song list that helps them get through the work day?
08:24 < aestetix> just use white noise
08:28 <@Evilpig> TheDukh_: I usually have plex running during the day and watch random shit
08:37 < k3ymkr> I'm usually listening to white noise
08:38 < k3ymkr> My white noise of choice lately has been the defcon stream on soma
08:39 < k3ymkr> I just saw yesterday that skydog was running the nashville dc group...or at least it says that on their page.  Is that valid?  Is it a healthy group?
08:41 < TheDukh_> dc615?
08:42 < oddball> could be.  He's been in with the DC goon squad for years.  Wouldn't surprise me if he started a new group.
08:45 <@Evilpig> that's troubling
08:46 <@Evilpig> but not surprising
08:48 < oddball> k3ymkr: Any sign that it's actually an active group?
08:50 < aestetix> god I hate these millennial kids
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09:03 < k3ymkr> No real sign, no
09:04 < k3ymkr> http://www.dc615.org/
09:04 < PigBot> Title: DC615 - Nashville Def Con Group (at www.dc615.org) http://tinyurl.com/zvhnxrp
09:06 < aestetix> oddball: what did he get in trouble for?
09:06 < aestetix> please tell me it involved little boys
09:06 <@oddball> At DC?  He hasn't, as far as I'm aware.
09:07 < aestetix> oh I misread that
09:07 < aestetix> I saw "been in with" and "troubling"
09:07 <@oddball> Nope.  As in "he hangs out with"
09:09 < k3ymkr> The twitter feed was last updated 14 hours ago
09:12 < k3ymkr> Facebook is locked, so I don't know
09:12 < k3ymkr> Doesn't look like a good sign if you want to join.
09:13 <@oddball> Looks to be a lot of the usual players with the Hacker Consortium.
09:23 <@Dolemite> oddball: Stillwater Kilts.  Any experience/opinion on them?
09:23 <@oddball> I have one of their sporrans, which, sadly, they stopped selling.
09:24 <@Dolemite> Considering getting one of their Boy Scout kilts now that I have earned my Wood Badge.
09:24 <@oddball> They have a good rep.
09:30 < aestetix> wood badge huh huh huh
09:31 <@oddball> Dolemite: If you're buying a traditional kilt, remember that you definitely need a sporran, and I'd highly recommend a kilt belt.
09:32 <@oddball> The belt isn't required (it's just for looks with those kilts, unless you're hanging something off of it), but I think it looks a lot better.
09:40 <@Dolemite> oddball: Yeah, they basically just wrap around your waist, righ?  Not much else to hold them up?
09:41 <@oddball> yep.  Either using velcro or leather straps to actually secure it together.
09:42 <@oddball> Oh, forgot the kilt pin.  Beyond the decoritive bit, it acts as a weight to help keep that flap down.
09:52 < _NSAKEY> I actually heard about the local dc group pretty recently.
09:53 < _NSAKEY> Skydog is on their old page or whatever, but isn't known to be involved with the current incarnation. That's still an open question, but the signs appear to be pointing towards no.
09:54 < _NSAKEY> Either way, I get the impression that he's one insane, public utterance from being as ostracized in the local tech community as crazypants. Apparently you guys aren't the only ones he's committed random acts of shameless idiocy against.
09:55 <@oddball> this is my shocked face.
09:55 < _NSAKEY> The numbers point to his con being aptly named.
09:55 < _NSAKEY> It's just a circlejerk for his friends, and hasn't been relevant in a few years.
09:57 < _NSAKEY> With 2 consecutive years of shrinking numbers under his belt, I'm about as concerned about SDC taking away from PhreakNIC as I am the Chuck E Cheese in the Stones River Mall.
09:58 <@Dolemite> Hey, now, they have an AWESOME ball pit at Chuck E Cheese
09:58 <@oddball> Wait... there's a Chuck E Cheese in the mall?  Dooood! I'm going over there! :p
09:59 < _NSAKEY> Yup. http://www.stonesrivermall.com/store/chuck-e-cheeses/6445/2138808447
09:59 <@Dolemite> Yep, attended many a birthday party there.
09:59 < PigBot> Title: Chuck E. Cheese's at Stones River Mall in Murfreesboro, TN :: 615-217-8842 - TN (at www.stonesrivermall.com) http://tinyurl.com/hsfwt3h
09:59 <@Dolemite> You have Books-a-Million on one side of the food court and Charles Edward Fromage on the other side.
10:13 < k3ymkr> What if skydog DID run the ballpit at CEC?
10:14 <@Dolemite> Then he'd likely be handling balls at prison by now.
10:16 < k3ymkr> I walked by him a time or two at DC23 and didn't so much as nod.
10:17 < TheDukh_> did you have your beard or no beard?  because I view that as two separate people.
10:18 < k3ymkr> Well, no beard because it's August in vegas.
10:18 < k3ymkr> It's not like we're good friends, but he knows who I am.
10:19 < k3ymkr> I didn't expect a hug, but a "hi" or wave would have been polite.
10:26 < _NSAKEY> k3ymkr: Then it would be a step up for him from SDC, based on the numbers alone.
10:27 < k3ymkr> Has anyone thought of the irony about how he started outerz0ne to protest rockit and then he basically became rockit?
10:27 <@Dolemite> I've made that connection many times
10:28 < k3ymkr> Speaking of people acting like an ass, see the weev/printer thing?
10:28 <@Dolemite> yeah
10:28 < dasunt> Oh, I live near Stillwater Kilts.
10:28 <@Dolemite> But that's just weev in general
10:28 <@Evilpig> k3ymkr: if you expected a nod from skydick you have to ask yourself this "what have you done for skydog today?"
10:29 < k3ymkr> I'm wondering if the CFAA could be stretched to include hate crimes.
10:29 < k3ymkr> Though, I'm not even certain that printing to unauthenticated printers on the internet IS illegal
10:30 < dasunt> Probably could be considered illegal under some BS.
10:30 < k3ymkr> Seems analogous to connecting to an open wifi
10:31 < dasunt> k3ymkr: Theft of services maybe?
10:31  * dasunt shrugs.
10:31 < dasunt> I saw the printer story first, then later saw it was identified as weev, and I lost interest.
10:37 < aestetix> lololol
10:37 < aestetix> JUST IN: Corey Lewandowski, @realDonaldTrump's campaign manager, arrested; charged with misdemeanor battery of ex-Breitbart reporter.
10:38 < dasunt> Well, just three more days, then the GOP and Dems can admit that they've pulled the best April Fool's joke ever.
10:38  * dasunt can't wait to see the real candidates.
10:38 < aestetix> https://twitter.com/CBSNews
10:38 < PigBot> Title: CBS News (@CBSNews) | Twitter (at twitter.com) http://tinyurl.com/lott7mx
10:51 < dasunt> I'm looking at IFTTT (since it got mentioned on /.), and I'm trying to figure out what you'd use this service for.
10:52 < TheDukh_> Is the Donald going to pay their legal fees?
10:57 <@sasquatc4> dasunt, it can do alot of neat things, automate alot of stuff, but then when you get down to it you realize i dont really need any of this shit
10:57 <@sasquatc4> at least thats the conclusion i came to
10:58 <@sasquatc4> like i dont need an automated text or email about the weather, or when some shit changes on some website i use
10:58 <@Dagmar> So the deal with Weev's little act of fuckwittery is that you don't have an expectation of an invitation to access a printer port
10:59 <@Dagmar> You can go to a web server on a server you've never seen before and look at it's top-level page and no one can ever touch you over that beacause it's common useage sets the expectation that it is a _public_ service
10:59 <@Dagmar> Printers are pretty much never public.
11:01 <@Dagmar> It's also rather possible he could get nailed on the fact that he sent junk documents to printers which also double as fax machines because that is also pretty illegal in most places
11:04 < dasunt> sasquatc4: I'd actually be cool if Android's built in cards would give me a weather forecast for the ride home, but all they give is the travel time, which almost never changes.
11:04 < dasunt> But do I want to give power to IFTTT just to get that functionality?
11:06 <@Dagmar> Just start asking it about the weatehr
11:06 < _NSAKEY> Dagmar: I saw an exchange on Twitter where someone said that his stunt wasn't original, and cited junk faxing in the 90s.
11:07 <@Dagmar> Hell, I've made a bunch of printers put "KILL THEM ALL" on their status windows
11:07 <@Dagmar> This stunt of his was dumb
11:07 < _NSAKEY> Personally, the one thing I found funny about the printer stunt was the fact that all these universities got upset to the point of wanting to file police reports based on the content of the print job itself.
11:07 <@Dagmar> In Tennessee they might be able to
11:08 < _NSAKEY> Other than that, it was a mildly interesting facelift to junk faxing.
11:08 <@Dagmar> If he really wanted to maximize splash damage, what he would have printed would have been an anonymous bomb threat
11:08 < _NSAKEY> Now you're just giving aestetix ideas.
11:10 < dasunt> I think it would be more interesting to play with the firmware and have it switch phrases to something provocative.
11:11 < _NSAKEY> dasunt: On that note, it would be even more interesting to kink the firmware and have it send copies of all the print jobs to something that records it, even if that something is a netcat listener out in the wild.
11:12 < aestetix> ugh I am getting fat
11:12 <@Dagmar> You could always go dig up a few hax JWZ put together around '99...
11:12 < aestetix> I think I put on like 15 pounds in the last 3 years :/
11:13 <@Dagmar> One was a PostScript document that cause a PostScript-capable printer to start repeating any print jobs it got to another PostScript-capable printer
11:13 <@Dagmar> Chaining all the open printers together would be much fun, but it would also apparently require more skill than Weeb had
11:14 < aestetix> if you could buffer overflow a printer over the network that would be hilarious
11:14 <@Dagmar> That would be a more useful thing to highlight about leaving _postscript-capable_ printers open to the internet.  It highlights the security aspect of such things much more clearly
11:14 <@Dagmar> Why would you need to overflow a printer?
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11:14 <@Dagmar> PostScript's a fucking language all on it's own
11:15 < aestetix> s/PostScript/TeX/
11:15 <@Dagmar> This is why you can make PostScript documents that _keep_ running
11:15 <@Dagmar> One of JWZ's other hax would make the printer begin randomly redacting words with a black rectangle
11:16 < dasunt> _NSAKEY: Got it - Send a copy of all the print jobs to wikileaks.  :p
11:17 < aestetix> lol
11:17 < aestetix> actually
11:18 < aestetix> send some wikileaks cables to the printers
11:18 < aestetix> oh oh oh oh
11:18 < aestetix> I got an even better idea
11:18 < aestetix> printerroulette
11:18 <@Dagmar> Yeah.
11:18 < aestetix> load up a website that gives you a random printer you can upload a document to
11:19 <@Dagmar> Uhh... you can use the "open ports" search engine
11:19 < _NSAKEY> aestetix: That sounds like a "give us bitcoins and send threats to a random printer" service.
11:19 < aestetix> hahaha
11:19 < aestetix> make it super easy to use
11:19 <@Dagmar> This shit is already super easy to sue
11:19 <@Dagmar> er use
11:19 < aestetix> you hit refresh, it randomly selects a printer, and you drag a filter onto the page and it automatically uploads and prints
11:20 <@Dagmar> Have you looked at Shodan?  Seriously.
11:20 <@Dagmar> You don't have to nmap people yourself unless you want a super-recent scan.
11:21 <@Dagmar> ...and it's not the only search engine like this.
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11:24 <@Dagmar> Honestly tho, as to the weather forecast for a bike ride home... Something like Arcus would be way more useful.
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12:00 <@Dagmar> Holy shit i'm going to set some people on fire today
12:02 <@Dagmar> If what I'm looking at on Comcast's site is correct, they've gotten it into their heads that I was renting the SB6141
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12:07  * oddball points Dagmar at the local Comcast offices and fires up the cameras.
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12:14  * dasunt_ has the urge to troll conservatives.
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12:15 <@dasunt> Imagine taking this iamge:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yiddish#/media/File:Yiddishsign.JPG
12:15 <@dasunt> Then captioning it as an example of Arabic being used in Muslim immigrant communities in the US.
12:15 <@dasunt> Think I'd get some hits?
12:39 < aestetix> HAHAHAHA
12:39 < aestetix> someone on an IDESG list just wrote this
12:39 < aestetix> As a Certified Identity Manager, it has always been an enigma and I cringe when
12:39 < aestetix> pseudonyms are allowed to be associated in the same sentence as identity
12:39 < aestetix> proofing. 
12:39 < aestetix> I just replied "what is a pseudonym?"
12:43 < aestetix> some of those guys *really* don't like me
12:47 <@Dagmar> I'd like to see those dimwits define it
12:47 <@Dagmar> ...without comitting a tautology.
12:48 < aestetix> lolol
12:48 < aestetix> They usually say "it's an unverified name"
12:48 < aestetix> So then I'm like "what is a verified name?"
12:48 < aestetix> And I get "a name that has been verified"
12:48 < aestetix> you KNOW I am not making this up
12:49 <@Dagmar> I'd call them on the tautology.
12:49 <@Dagmar> Every single time, I'd call them on it.
12:49 <@Dagmar> Merriam-Webster has better definitions
12:49 < aestetix> Fucking tumblr has better definitions.
12:50 <@Dagmar> There's nothing wrong with a pseudonym.  THere's actually rather a lot of history involved in them.  Mark Twain and Lewis Carroll for instance3
12:50 <@Dagmar> The second usage of 'identity' in Merriam-Webster is "the qualities, beliefs, etc., that make a particular person or group different from others"
12:51 <@Dagmar> ...which leads us straight to this being a data management issue.
12:51 <@Dagmar> We need a unique key to assign to a collection of details describing an identity, and only enough details to differentiate them from other identities
12:52 <@Dagmar> A person's "real name" is just one of those details, and it is not the key itself.
12:52 < aestetix> Dagmar: I usually make them balk when I ask if "Pope Francis" is a pseudonym
12:52 <@Dagmar> It's not unique within the scope it's being used, for one thing
12:53 <@Dagmar> ...and bringing scope into the matter leads us to the inescapably obvious detail that people use names which are not their full "legal" name, all the fucking time.
12:53 <@Dagmar> Names like, "Mom" and "Dad"
12:53 < aestetix> also wtf is a certified identity manager
12:53 <@Dagmar> No one bats an eye at those
12:53 <@Dagmar> aestetix: The sarcastic answer... "a cost center"
12:54 < aestetix> really, I want to just dump a few gallons of LSD in the DC/Virginia water supply
12:54 <@Dagmar> The most power I'd give someone in that capacity would be the power to ensure that the identity is associated with a singular physical human, and not a bot
12:54 <@Dagmar> Their job would be solely to introduce latency into the process
12:55 <@Dagmar> ...which would make things prohibitively expensive for the PR firms and corporations that would find thousands of fake "identities" cost-prohibitive
12:55 <@Dagmar> er find them useful
12:56 < aestetix> oh god he walked right into my trap
12:56 < aestetix> "A false name"
12:56 <@Dagmar> Call it for the tautological fallacy that it is
12:57 <@Dagmar> Circular reasoning will *not* sort out the problem.
12:57 <@Dagmar> Fuck.  I actually have the time for this shit now
12:57 <@Dagmar> I guess it's finally time to put on my Chomsky hat
12:57 < aestetix> holy shit
12:57 < aestetix> http://nvlpubs.nist.gov/nistpubs/SpecialPublications/NIST.SP.800-63-2.pdf
12:57 < PigBot> aestetix: That URL appears to have no HTML title within the first 20480 bytes.
12:58 < aestetix> Search for pseuodnym, and verified name
12:58 <@Dagmar> Oh hell that's nice
12:59 <@Dagmar> I never even thought to see if NIST had done any research into that field
12:59 < aestetix> they clearly didn't
13:00 <@Dagmar> Well, they've done most of hte work for you there
13:01 <@Dagmar> THe key is in the qualification of whether or not someone is "entitled to use the name"
13:01 <@Dagmar> ...because if we're defining that as "full legal name" then this goes nowhere and is a complete waste of time, and is therefore counter to the point of even _having_ the IDESG
13:02 <@Dagmar> So NIST is basically failing in defining a psuedonym as an "unverified name" and then turning around and saying if it differs from the "official name" then it's also a psuedonym.
13:03 <@Dagmar> ...but, this only pertains to names specified by a credential document
13:03 <@Dagmar> It'll require some careful logic, but I think I can build upon this document
13:03 <@Dagmar> ...and resolve the apparent conflict.
13:04 <@Dagmar> In doing that, one might be able to win over the architects of this NIST document
13:04 <@Dagmar> The people you're arguing with are perfectly able to just _ignore_ your uses of logic and stonewall this process indefinitely.
13:05 <@Dagmar> You need to be collecting accredited _allies_
13:05 <@Dagmar> aestetix: This document also references FIPS 201 meaninfully
13:05 <@Dagmar> er meaningfully
13:06 < aestetix> oh man
13:06 <@Dagmar> You see the footnote now
13:06  * Dagmar rubs hands together with glgee
13:06 <@Dagmar> er glee
13:06 < aestetix> 3. I followed the definition of "verified name", to "identity proofing", which lead me to "credential service provider" and "registration authority." If I und
13:06 < aestetix> erstand it correct, a registration authority can grant authority, and a credent
13:06 < aestetix> ial service provider can issue tokens that represent that authority. So if I, i
13:06 < aestetix> n this mail, assert that I am a registration authority, and am using this email as a token to verify that claim, I now have, under this definition, a verified name? :)
13:07 <@Dagmar> In theory these are all meant to be different parties to eliminate conflicts of interest resulting in meaningless issuances like that
13:08 <@Dagmar> I think you should follow that breadcrump to FIPS 201
13:08 < aestetix> What if I have MPD? :)
13:08 <@Dagmar> This seems to imply some committee already defined psuedonyms with persistent validity
13:09 <@Dagmar> Man I can't freakin' type today.  ANyhoo I need to run to the other side of town and back.
13:09 <@Dagmar> Gotta pick up some hardware to fix a few more things at the girlie's house
13:10 <@Dagmar> We can, in theory, use a 128-bit one-way hash for part of the CSP role described, by the way
13:11 <@Dagmar> Since the CSP is required to keep an association between a psudonym and a verified identity when a token is issued involving a pseudonym
13:11 <@Dagmar> ...but it only needs to be verifiable in one direction.
13:11 < aestetix> Dagmar: did you ever fucking join IDESG yet?
13:11 < aestetix> You could be having all kinds of fun.
13:13 < aestetix> This looks like it's all lifted from the Pfitzman paper
13:24 < aestetix> oh boy his response was not nice
13:24 < aestetix> I appreciate your consideration which seems to pertain to the spirit of 800-63
13:24 < aestetix> and current version. However the letter of 800-63 is quite clear regarding
13:24 < aestetix> registration/identity proofing requiring name verification for LOA 2-4.
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13:47 < _NSAKEY> RangerZ: https://twitter.com/MartinShkreli/status/714886468926353409
13:52 < TheDukh_> he goes to Slipknot moshpits?
14:10 < aestetix> ugh
14:10 < aestetix> this is one of those days where I should have gone to bed an hour ago
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15:25 <@Mirage> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45X4VP8CGtk
15:25 < PigBot> Title: Heres What Happens When an 18 Year Old Buys a Mainframe - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) http://tinyurl.com/jeec9er
15:29 <@rattle> I'm sure the answer doesn't involve getting laid.
15:31 <@Mirage> it could.. =P
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18:30 <@Evilpig> come on comcast.  let's ride this coaster just one more time!
18:30 <@Evilpig> I think they're going for a record for the number of times they can reset my modem in an afternoon
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19:22 <@RangerZ> _NSAKEY: or anyone else associated with bsides nashville
19:22 <@RangerZ> is this correct....
19:22 <@RangerZ> Bsides Nashville is a local educational non-profit for professionals in security related fields. It hosts a yearly conference (Sat. April 16th this year) in Nashville about security for both educational and recruitment purposes. There will be presentations in three different levels (Beginner, Intermediate, and Advanced) on different security related topics. In addition there is recruitment booths setup
19:22 <@RangerZ> throughout the area where students can inquire about internships and potential job opportunities.
19:22 <@RangerZ> So if any students, undergraduate or graduate, would be interested in attending, they can for fairly cheap($10), or they can do so for free if they want to volunteer for a portion of the con. Volunteering, beyond just the free admission, is also a good way to network with those involved in the con. So if anyone would like to volunteer, they can sign up at the google doc link provided[2].
19:22 <@RangerZ> going to forward that (not sure who yet, but someone on campus)
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23:44 <@RangerZ> so TruCrypt got outted as what ISIS uses
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