--- Log opened Thu Dec 10 00:00:25 2015
04:03 < aestetix> I love south park
05:41 <@Dagmar> Wow.  Merlin's here now, and Mortie is really acting like a bitch
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07:07 <@Evilpig> oh man.  cartman with a glock
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07:17 < aestetix_> Evilpig: yeah that episode is hilarious
07:18 < aestetix_> this german class I'm taking
07:18 < aestetix_> going over countries.... it's supposed to be easy. I don't know what half these fucking flags are.
07:20 <@Evilpig> the southpark gun show...  ROFL
07:20 <@Evilpig> oddball: you've got to see this.  hahhaaha
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07:34 <@Evilpig> jesus....
07:35 <@Evilpig> "To close your account please return your tags via certified mail to NJ E-ZPass Customer Service Center, PO Box 52003, Newark, NJ 07101. Also include a signed letter by the account holder requesting to close the account. If your current method of replenishment is by a credit card please provide the current expiration date."
07:35 <@Evilpig> really?  all that just to close an account
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--- Log opened Thu Dec 10 08:38:47 2015
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--- Log opened Thu Dec 10 08:59:11 2015
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09:19 < _NSAKEY> Dagmar: That's Lucius Fox.
09:23 <@Evilpig> fuckin' comcast.  I swear.  define contactgroup { contactgroup_name       NDE-prod alias                   ND&E members                 NDE-email
09:23 <@Evilpig> doh!
09:23 <@Evilpig>  System Uptime: 0 days 0h: 28m: 25s 
09:23 <@Evilpig> modem reset again
09:23 <@Evilpig> time to light em up
10:09 < aestetix_> Ok maybe you guys can tell me
10:10 < aestetix_> why is it when I bring up a discussion on christianity, purely for non-religious historicity discussion, any group of self-proclaimed open minded folks becomes really angry and stubborn
10:11 <@opticron> angry and stubborn about what?
10:12 <@opticron> is this open-minded group predominantly christian?
10:13 < _NSAKEY> Another question: Which period of history are you trying to discuss?
10:16 < aestetix_> _NSAKEY: in this case, my question was "The church used to be the foundation of science and knowledge, and now it clearly is not. What happened?"
10:16 < aestetix_> and I got a bunch of snarky comments, all of which I quickly argued against with evidence
10:17 < _NSAKEY> Hahahaha.
10:17 < aestetix_> It's like people have this hate against their parents being religious, and target it against the church, regardless of context. Which is both unfair and unscientific.
10:18 < aestetix_> And I get accused of all this supernatural shit, when I'm like "you know, I never claimed any of that, I'm looking at history for purely evidence and fact based things"
10:19 < _NSAKEY> Do any of them bring up the Crusades?
10:20 < aestetix_> Not yet, but that's something I am still reading about.
10:20 <@oddball> aestetix_: Simple: the louder someone claims to be "open minded," the less they are.
10:20 < aestetix_> I've already found a viewpoint on Galileo that was very interesting, and made me question the narrative I knew.
10:20 < aestetix_> Next will be the crusades.
10:21 < _NSAKEY> If you want to have some real fun regarding the crusades, I just looked at Wikipedia and according to it, the highest estimated death count for all the crusades is 3 million.
10:22 < _NSAKEY> Of course, that was spread out over a couple hundred years.
10:22 < aestetix_> oddball: reminds me of a talk I saw by a jewish rabbi. they said "often someone will see me in the store and say, I'm sorry but I don't believe in god. and I respond, well describe what you mean by god, I probably don't believe in that either"
10:22 < _NSAKEY> WWII had way more people die.
10:22 < _NSAKEY> Or you could look at the crazy, paranoid purges Stalin did. He killed more people.
10:23 < _NSAKEY> Or even Mao, with his jaw-dropping incompetence, killed more people.
10:23 < aestetix_> Although I admit I am getting really pissed off at Richard Dawkins.
10:23 <@oddball> aestetix_: heh
10:24 < aestetix_> It's the same with the idiots who cry out for social progress
10:24 < _NSAKEY> Even if you go with the lower estimates of the number of people who died during the Great Leap Forward, it still dwarfs the Crusades.
10:24 < aestetix_> But they can never say what they actually want
10:24 <@oddball> I did have a history teacher that had the theory that the crusades were a plot by the Pope to get the violent knights to stop chopping each other up.
10:25 < aestetix_> but I mean
10:25 < aestetix_> I had friends who laughed mockingly when they saw a news article recently (last couple years) that the pope acknowledged the big bang
10:25 < aestetix_> They didn't like it when I pointed out that the big bang theory was proposed by a catholic priest
10:26 <@oddball> That reminds me.  I'm amused at the number of folks I've pissed off when they've told me that they think folks on the no fly list/terrorist watch list shouldn't be able to by/own guns "oh, so you don't believe in due process... good to know."
10:26 <@oddball> "I never said that!"  "yes. yes you did.  Just now.
10:26 <@oddball> "
10:26 <@oddball> aestetix_: Was it?  Huh.  Did not known that.
10:26 < aestetix_> oddball: the reason I say that law SHOULD be passed is that a bunch of people will suddenly find themeslves unable to buy guns, and it will expose how stupid/shitty the no fly list is.
10:27 < _NSAKEY> aestetix_: I actually learned about that in the last year or so, and was highly amused.
10:28 <@oddball> aestetix_: It's shitty, and needs to be done away with, but I don't think that the outcome would be what you hope.
10:28 < aestetix_> oddball: the reason you are correct is because the US does not use logic to make laws
10:28 <@oddball> yup
10:29 <@oddball> The argument against getting rid of the lists would become "oh, so you want terrorists to have guns?!"
10:30 < _NSAKEY> I think there are entirely too many Republicans in office right now for that kind of legislation to be taken seriously.
10:31 <@oddball> Well, in that the Dems already tried to cram it down our throats when no one was looking last week and failed?  I'd say you're correct. :p
10:32 <@oddball> Although, the vote in the Senate was basically down party lines.
10:34 < _NSAKEY> Plus, if it did... Do you really think that the congress critters who voted for it would feel safe anymore?
10:34 < _NSAKEY> That would be the single biggest driver of off-the-books gun purchases in a generation.
10:34 < aestetix_> _NSAKEY: yes, because they would get kickbacks from some lobbyist
10:34 < _NSAKEY> aestetix_: I mean safe as in, somebody isn't going to murder them.
10:35 < _NSAKEY> These kinds of legislative pushes are always big drivers of gun sales.
10:35 < _NSAKEY> Hell, Obama getting elected was a huge shot in the arm for the gun industry. oddball can probably back that up.
10:36 <@oddball> yup
10:36 < _NSAKEY> People at gun shows were buying guns and ammo up like the world was ending.
10:36 < _NSAKEY> Common calibers sold as fast as they went up on shelves for months.
10:36 < _NSAKEY> It took maybe 2 years for the supply chain to stop getting constantly drained.
10:36 <@oddball> We've had record gun sales for basically the last 7 years.
10:37 < _NSAKEY> Why? Because Obama got elected, and the paranoia went into overdrive.
10:37 < aestetix_> And record shooting of black people :)
10:37 <@oddball> And .22lr still hasn't recovered.
10:37 < _NSAKEY> I quit going to the shows around then, because it was just that crazy.
10:37 <@oddball> aestetix_: Actually, no... quite the opposite, actually.
10:38 < _NSAKEY> But think about this... If the no fly list gets used as a "Can't buy guns list," then those people are just going to buy one without an FFL being involved.
10:38 < _NSAKEY> That means the paper trail doesn't exist.
10:38 <@oddball> I'll admit that I don't have the stats broken down by ethnicity at hand, but we're currently experiencing the least amount of gunshot fatalities since the FBI started recording that stat in the '60's.
10:39 <@oddball> and general violence is at a 100 year low.
10:39 <@oddball> (both per capita)
10:40 < _NSAKEY> Between there being no paper trail and the fact that people make death threats, I'm pretty sure that it wouldn't be fun to be someone who voted for that if it had passed.
10:41 <@oddball> I'm trying to find a source of the actual vote numbers, but it was basically "if the Dems had a majority in the Senate, it would have passed."
10:41 < _NSAKEY> That's how it goes with anything related to gun "control."
10:42 <@oddball> Pretty much.  It wasn't the case when Obama first took office, because the dems in congress remembered the fallout of them passing the Clinton AWB.
10:42 < _NSAKEY> Yeah, and that law was a stupid joke.
10:42 < _NSAKEY> I like how there are still some dems who at least pretend to think that full-auto weapons are now legal on a federal level.
10:42 <@oddball> And now they've tried to pass a new AWB that's even dumber!
10:43 < _NSAKEY> There was a comical amount of disinformation around the the time AWB sunsetted that centered around full-auto guns.
10:43 <@oddball> Well, it is possible to legally own a machine gun.  It just has to have been made and registered before '86.
10:43 < _NSAKEY> There's also the mountain of paperwork.
10:44 <@oddball> yep
10:44 <@oddball> I'd love to see the ban on new machine guns go away.
10:44 <@oddball> Fucking Rengal
10:44 < _NSAKEY> But, I'm talking about, like if Bob buys a fully automatic AK47 from Alice at a gun show and the only condition is that Bob has to meet Alice's asking price... That's still illegal.
10:46 <@oddball> ah, right.
10:46 < _NSAKEY> There was a non-trivial portion of the population who thought that was going to become legal when the ban expired.
10:46 <@oddball> Yes, I totally see machine gun and grenade purchases all the damn time at gun shows.
10:46  * oddball rolls eyes
10:48 <@oddball> I still bang my head everytime someone says that we need to have background checks on internet sales.  Uh... we already do.
10:48 < _NSAKEY> I saw some "parts only" (As in, here's a pile of parts, put them together yourself)  assault rifles for sale every now and then when I used to go, and even saw an M79 stock for sale one time.
10:49 < _NSAKEY> That's about as close to shady as Goodman's ever got.
10:49 <@oddball> You sure those kits had the reciever?  I've seen a lot of those kits, but they always skipped on that... since that's legally "the gun."
10:50 < _NSAKEY> It was so long ago, I don't remember.
10:50 < _NSAKEY> Any time I saw those, it was always some gun from a country with a hard to pronounce name, and not something that was widely known.
10:53 <@oddball> bwahaha Meme picture on my FB feed: "Is it rude to toss a Xanax in someone's mouth while they're talking?"
10:56 < _NSAKEY> Rude.
11:12 <@oddball> Yes, but don't tell me you wouldn't be tempted once or twice with some folks.
11:14 <@Evilpig> just once or twice?
11:14 <@oddball> Well, you might need to buy in bulk.
11:22 <@RangerZ> hopefully Elonka won't have moved away before the next nashville2600 meeting
11:23 <@RangerZ> the startup she was at... went *poof*startup ending*poof*
11:23 <@oddball> Yeah... I'm really hoping she finds something around here.
11:23 <@oddball> Ah, id that what happened?
11:24 <@RangerZ> started not being able to make payroll
11:24 <@RangerZ> and then 'door closed'
11:24 <@oddball> ugh... suck
11:24 <@RangerZ> I told her to apply to Vandy Med center or univ, since they will need more project managers here soon with the split
11:25 <@oddball> yep
11:25 <@RangerZ> she wasn't receptive
11:26 <@RangerZ> she wants to get back into gaming
11:26 <@oddball> I'm guessing that she's wanting to stay in that industry.
11:26 <@RangerZ> I told her to take a "Dagmar Year"
11:26 <@RangerZ> lol
11:26 <@oddball> Which... unfortunately, means that she probably will be moving.
11:28 <@RangerZ> at this point, I'll tell her to take an oddball decade ;)
11:28 <@RangerZ> hehe
11:28 <@RangerZ> but FYI, land tax will be raising next year, and the predictions are ~29% increase in places in town
11:29 <@oddball> *sigh*
11:29 <@RangerZ> apparently TN does it every 4 years
11:31 <@RangerZ> Thankfully thats only really true in the lower end of East Nashville, and south of the airport and to the west of the 24
11:31  * RangerZ put in the are I -think- oddball lives for ... not reason other than effect ;)
11:31 <@RangerZ> damn it... east* is what I meant
11:31 <@RangerZ> but w/e, lol
11:32 <@oddball> Yeah.  My neighborhood seems to be the one place that is worth living in that hasn't seen the giant boost in land value.
11:32 <@RangerZ> upper end of East Nashville next to Madison is like that too
11:32 <@RangerZ> thats the only reason I haven't moved yet
11:32 <@oddball> Actually, I take that back.  Oddly, West Meade hasn't really seen it either.
11:33 <@RangerZ> 782$/mo for 1000sq.ft. 2 bedroom 2x 1/2 bath apt
11:33 <@oddball> ...which is where I'd like to move once the money is going in the right direction again.
11:33 <@RangerZ> can't get that if you are whoring for the landlord pretty much anywhere else in nashville now
11:34 <@oddball> Yeah... that's why we bought this house.  It was significantly cheaper than renting a smaller apartment.
11:34 <@RangerZ> new rentals are like 250$/mo more than that or so
11:36 <@RangerZ> yeah, but I haven't had the money to even pretend to do that
11:37 <@RangerZ> email...[Crow Dispersal Actions Start Today]
11:37 <@RangerZ> lol
11:39 <@RangerZ> apparently some people don't like reliving the movie "The Birds" on a daily basis
11:43 <@oddball> The fuck?  The cop is blaming his shooting someone on the fact that his Glock's trigger pull was apparently 11.5lbs instead of 12? http://www.nbcnews.com/news/asian-america/cop-accused-fatally-shooting-unarmed-black-man-may-have-had-n476906
11:43 < PigBot> Title: Cop Accused of Fatally Shooting Unarmed Black Man May Have Had Defective Gun, Lawyers Say - NBC News (at www.nbcnews.com)
11:44 <@oddball> By the way, a standard off the shelf Glock has a trigger pull of about 6lbs... the NYPD decided that their officers were too stupid for that light of a pull.
11:56 <@RangerZ> "glock knee"
11:56 <@RangerZ> or "glock leg"
11:56 <@RangerZ> I forget what it was called
11:56 <@oddball> yep "glock leg"
11:57 <@oddball> In this case, the cop had the gun out and is apparently claiming that that extra half a pound trigger pull would have stopped him from pulling the trigger.
11:59 <@RangerZ> why was his finger on the trigger if he wasn't trying to pull
11:59 <@RangerZ> ohh wait
11:59 <@RangerZ> training
11:59 <@RangerZ> or lack there of
11:59 <@oddball> but cops are the only ones professional enough and with enough training!
12:00 <@RangerZ> they have tons of training
12:00 <@RangerZ> I'm just saying it is mostly in 'escalation'
12:00 <@RangerZ> police camp is 19 weeks or something
12:00 <@RangerZ> 3 years in parts of EU
12:01  * oddball nods
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12:02 <@RangerZ> that alone helps explain a LOT of the police situation in the US
12:03 <@oddball> yep
12:03 <@RangerZ> that and the 2008 decision that for the first time gave the right of private gun ownership to citizens
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12:03  * RangerZ enjoys shanking oddball like that
12:03  * oddball glares
12:04 <@RangerZ> hehe
12:05 <@RangerZ> oddball: some good news, and some bad news.... steam will be shut down after xmas for a week, something about maint.
12:05 <@RangerZ> they will be specifically working on the updater for Fallout 4
12:05 <@RangerZ> lol
12:05 -!- fie [~fie@ip70-178-64-114.ks.ks.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
12:05 <@RangerZ> (not true, but would be amusing)
12:06 <@RangerZ> oddball "I finally got it... and god damn it... another week"
12:06 <@oddball> See... that's just mean
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12:08 <@RangerZ> lol
12:08 <@RangerZ> if you had PS4 I'd let you play my copy
12:09 <@RangerZ> I have the pipboy version
12:09 <@RangerZ> unopened
12:09 <@RangerZ> just going to sell
12:09 <@RangerZ> thought I'd want it, but honestly just don't have time
12:12 <@oddball> You managed to score one of the pipboy editions?  Fucker.
12:12 <@RangerZ> went on amazon immediately and ordered it
12:13 <@RangerZ> I'm thinking of undercutting people and selling for 150$  or so
12:13 <@oddball> oops... looks like they did start making more.
12:14 <@oddball> Amazon has them on sale right now for $120.
12:14 <@RangerZ> ahh
12:14 <@RangerZ> no, just re-stocks
12:14 <@RangerZ> amazon bought all the back copy from gamestop/etc
12:14 <@RangerZ> didn't think they STILL had them though
12:14 <@RangerZ> they must be spacing the sales out
12:15 <@oddball> Yeah... just tripped over a blog post saying that Amazon put 'em back up.
12:15 <@RangerZ> OHH wait only PC version left
12:16 <@RangerZ> amazon is getting a bit shady when you click on search results
12:16 <@oddball> yeah...
12:16 <@RangerZ> shows 'msrp' even if not in stock, and only for sale except for [non-amazon]
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14:38 <@Evilpig> http://www.tshirthell.com/funny-shirts/i-beat-plan-b/
14:38 < PigBot> Title: T-Shirt Hell :: Shirts :: I BEAT PLAN B (at www.tshirthell.com)
14:40 <@RangerZ> plan b wasn't around THAT long ago
14:40 <@RangerZ> but *shrugs*
14:40 <@Evilpig> it's a baby shirt
14:43 <@RangerZ> that would definitely not fit you , way too small
14:54 <@Mirage> NL needs this one.. http://www.tshirthell.com/funny-shirts/if-you-have-a-whistle-now-is-the-time/
14:54 < PigBot> Title: T-Shirt Hell :: Shirts :: IF YOU HAVE A WHISTLE NOW IS THE TIME (at www.tshirthell.com)
14:56 <@Evilpig> hehe
15:26 <@Dagmar> They made $120 million the first day
15:26 <@Dagmar> Yeah, I'd think that wouild be reason to have a few more copies made up
15:27 <@Evilpig> i'm ready to go home
15:28  * phy1729 is ready too
15:42 < _NSAKEY> http://fossbytes.com/this-coder-forces-careless-twitter-users-to-tweet-meow-i/
15:50 <@Dagmar> ++ to that guy
16:12 < dasunt> I'm looking for a simple notetaking app for android that doesn't suck.
16:12 < dasunt> One that doesn't require an active data plan would be great.  Suggestions?
16:13 -!- crash180 [~Adium@pdpc/supporter/silver/CRasH180] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
16:13 <@Dagmar> Keep
16:14  * dasunt tries it.
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16:18 < dasunt> One of these days, I really need to upgrade to something that is powerful, ideally linux compatible, but not web based for my historical research.
16:19 < dasunt> But right now, I just need to keep dumb notes on my phone for misc stuff.
16:20 <@Evilpig> like which hooker was the best?
16:21 < dasunt> Evilpig: Of course.
16:21 < dasunt> Actually it's for my genealogy crap, so I'm really not happy with sharing mother's maiden name, etc, with the intarwebs.
16:22 <@Evilpig> if you're gonna be picking up hookers, at least don't pick up family members.  damn man.  I mean shit.
16:23 < aestetix_> ...
16:29 < dasunt> Actually, I believe I can infer a reference to hookers for at least once ancestor of mine.
16:30 < dasunt> They were written up in military records for failing to report a VD.
16:30 < dasunt> Which apparently was an offense in the military around c. 1900 or so.
16:33 <@Evilpig> speaking of hookers.  i'm off to notlarry's
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16:59 < aestetix_> so, am I correct in understanding that Nashville is having gentrification issues?
16:59 < aestetix_> What I don't get is that Berlin is having them too. Like, pretty much every western city is having them. So it's not just a reversal of white flight.
17:00 < aestetix_> Incidentally, one of the factors causing Berlin to gentrify is London expats who can no longer afford their rent because of London gentrification.
17:03 < dasunt> I am not sure that "gentrification" leads to major issues.
17:04 < aestetix_> Well, it causes prices to skyrocket.
17:04 < dasunt> I know it's assumed to, but the only data I've seen on gentrification seems to indicate that existing property owners to benefit.
17:04 < aestetix_> This is also true.
17:04 < _NSAKEY> aestetix_: It started here about 10 years ago, and was concentrated mostly in East Nashville.
17:04 < _NSAKEY> The cops decided that they could actually, you know, enforce laws around Dickerson Rd (Up the street from where PhreakNIC used to be held).
17:06 < _NSAKEY> Once that started happening around 2003, it took a couple of years before real estate in East Nashville started skyrocketing.
17:06 < dasunt> Here's my hypothesis:  Rents and prices tend to increase across the board, regardless of location (due to inflation).  Some parts of an area are considered more desirable than other parts.  So the increased prices of "gentrification" in one neighborhood should be offset by another neighborhood seeing prices not increase as expected due to diminished popularity.
17:07 < aestetix_> On a possibly related note, I know that crime inexplicably plummeted in the early 90s, and has been at an all time low. I wonder if all the mass shootings in the US will change that.
17:08 < aestetix_> dasunt: that makes sense, especially given that the interest rate has been basically nothign.
17:08 < dasunt> aestetix_: I'd argue that the biggest problem I could see with gentrification is how the population shifts as cities become more desirable and suburbs become less desirable.
17:08 < aestetix_> When Janet Yellen raises it, I imagine we'll see a bit of deflation happen.
17:08 < aestetix_> dasunt: that's the reverse white flight argument.
17:08 < aestetix_> But what I'm seeing in Berlin refutes it.
17:08 < dasunt> Cities tend to be a hell of a lot better for livability, especially without a car.
17:09 < aestetix_> European cities are having the same problem, and suburbs don't really exist in Europe.
17:09 < _NSAKEY> They also bulldozed almost all of the old housing projects, and replaced them with actual houses. They're still section 8, but there are fewer people now.
17:09 < aestetix_> _NSAKEY: I imagine that could change in the next few years
17:09 < dasunt> So I could see that side of gentrification being a big downer, but you'd have to study it to verify that (a) suburbanites spend a higher percentage of their income on transportation that isn't offset in other places and (b) displaced urbanites move to the suburbs.
17:09 < _NSAKEY> By contrast, homeowners in the new expensive areas are bulldozing houses and building places that can house 3-4 families on the same property.
17:10 < _NSAKEY> aestetix_: How so? There's only like, two sets of the old housing projects left.
17:10 < aestetix_> _NSAKEY: I predict a massive increase in poverty and unemployment in the next 20 years
17:10 < dasunt> Also, re: crime rates in the 1990s, there's a really controversial argument that Roe vs. Wade had a big effect on crime rates.
17:10 < aestetix_> dasunt: that's the freakanomics argument, which I don't really buy.
17:10 < aestetix_> The other major argument is lead content in water.
17:11 < dasunt> Both the lead argument and the abortion argument seem strong to me, from what limited information I've read.
17:11 < _NSAKEY> aestetix_: The fact that the old housing projects got bulldozed doesn't stop homeowners from other areas applying for section 8 money.
17:11 < aestetix_> true
17:11 < _NSAKEY> For example, Lake Forest in La Vergne... I don't know about now, but before a non-trivial number of the houses were section 8.
17:12 < _NSAKEY> There's a little over 3,000 houses in this subdivision, and at one time one person controlled over 400 of them.
17:12 < _NSAKEY> All were section 8. She was making the tenants do side notes, which is a giant no-no...
17:12 < _NSAKEY> All 400+ families got evicted by the feds over about a week.
17:13 < _NSAKEY> That was 2009-2010, and my street didn't get completely re-populated until about a year ago.
17:13 < dasunt> Where I'm at, in Minneapolis/St. Paul, gentrification is very different between the two cities.  In Minneapolis, we're slowly gentrifying certain neighborhoods.  In St. Paul, the residents still seem stuck in white flight mode.
17:13 < dasunt> It's weird how two cities that border each other can be so different.
17:14 < _NSAKEY> There was a cluster of abuot 5-6 houses that just... sat empty.
17:14 < _NSAKEY> *about
17:16 < dasunt> That reminds me, I'm beginning to actively hate a few of my neighbors.
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17:17 < dasunt> My neighborhood is probably dating from the 1910s to 1940s, give or take for the housing.  Not bad, most of the housing looks pretty nice.
17:18 < dasunt> But a few people have come into the neighborhood, bought property just to tear it down and build something new.  Again, something I'm not opposed to in principle.  Sometimes housing can't be saved.
17:19 < dasunt> The problem is that these dumbshits tear down something like a 1,500 or 2,000 sq foot house which fits the lot and has a decent exterior appearance, and then build a 4,000 square foot monstrosity that looks completely out of place.
17:19 < _NSAKEY> I thought you were going to say that they were replacing the old houses with condos.
17:20 < _NSAKEY> That's what would happen here.
17:21 < dasunt> No.  That would be bad as well, but the condo phase is over in my area.  Building suburban houses on urban lots is the new craze.
17:21 < aestetix_> _NSAKEY: that also happened in the Bay Area in the 90s. Then when the bubble burst, a bunch of luxury condos sat totally empty.
17:22 < dasunt> Here's a picture which is semi-okay at showing the problem - look at the new house and the old house next to it:  https://www.minnpost.com/politics-policy/2014/03/teardown-battle-minneapolis-city-war-itself
17:22 < PigBot> Title: Teardown battle in Minneapolis: A city at war with itself | MinnPost (at www.minnpost.com)
17:22 < _NSAKEY> aestetix_: Well, that's what's happening in the areas of Nashville that are booming now.
17:23 < _NSAKEY> dasunt: Yeah, that's just gross.
17:23 < dasunt> They stick out like sore thumbs.
17:23 < _NSAKEY> My grandmother's old neighborhood had some houses that were torn down and replaced with newer ones. The difference is that the new houses were kept roughly the same size as whatever they replaced.
17:24 < aestetix_> Incidentally, Berlin and Germany in general have a set of issues that make today appear similar to the US with gentrification issues, but are totally differnet.
17:24 < dasunt> _NSAKEY: That's how it should be.  Or at the very least, work to hide the additional size.
17:24 < _NSAKEY> There was one that was bigger, but that was because the original house was tiny.
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17:25 < aestetix_> For example, after East Berlin collapsed, many of the property records were burned/lost. So there were a bunch of buildings and nobody knew who owned or lived in what.
17:25 < aestetix_> And given the flight of population to the west from East Berlin, that meant a lot of vacancies and abandoned buildings.
17:26 < aestetix_> So now a generation later, there is something that looks similar to reverse white flight, but had very different roots.
17:26 < aestetix_> Although I do not want to think of what the Syria drama is going to do.
17:27 < aestetix_> Apparently some schools are being forced to donate their gymnasiums and sports fields to the refugees. Given that the refugee processing time takes a couple months minimum, it's directly impacting schoolchildren :/
17:31 < dasunt> Okay, I need to run.
17:31  * dasunt is AFK.
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19:46 <@Dagmar> aestetix_; Well, we could also send them all back and wait for htem to be ground up into hamburger
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19:47 <@Dagmar> aestetix_: ...because basically, Syria _used_ to be an almost modern country, and now most of it is rubble on par with a great deal of London after The Blitz
19:47 <@Dagmar> It can't even _hope_ to sustain anything like the original population density
19:47 <@Dagmar> 20-30 years and a whole lot of money will be needed before it's back up to speed
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19:48 <@Dagmar> Plenty of people can die of starvation and disease in that amount of time
19:48 <@RangerZ> Dagmar: plus the revolt was spurred on because of the multi-year drought that has been hitting the nation
19:48 <@Dagmar> I was just shocked at the level of devastation
19:49 <@Dagmar> Not to appear ingress-obsessed or anything, but someone who plays it and is a photographer went in there to take pictures so people could understand the level of destruction
19:49 <@Dagmar> Like, why is this portal uncontrolled?  Because everything for two miles is fuckin' rubble so deep and so scattered you can scarcely tell there was a street there
19:51 <@Dagmar> ...and they pulled "before" pictures with Google Maps
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21:54 <@Evilpig> http://psnprofiles.com/trophies/4012-Fallout-4/W1lpig
21:54 < PigBot> Title: W1lpig's Fallout 4 Trophies - PSNProfiles.com (at psnprofiles.com)
22:01 <@RangerZ> [Placed A Grenade Or Mine While Pickpocketing]
22:01 <@RangerZ> lol
22:12 <@Evilpig> yeah I hadn't even thought of that.  now I wanna
22:31 <@oddball> hot potato is a favorite tactic of mine when I want to kill people that don't shoot me on sight.
23:05 <@RangerZ> I played too much thief as a kid
23:05 <@RangerZ> I love setting up traps
23:05 <@RangerZ> but I've only played fallout 1 & 2....
23:05 <@RangerZ> lol
23:19 <@RangerZ> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3et6NXPFxI
23:20 <@RangerZ> damn it... I only clicked the link betting it was TN, but it was Massura(how I'm sure he says it)
23:20 <@RangerZ> [Man With Noose And Confederate Flag Says He’s Not A Racist]
23:23 <@RangerZ> +1 mullet
--- Log closed Fri Dec 11 00:00:27 2015