--- Log opened Wed Aug 12 00:00:25 2015
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08:56 <@Dagmar> BWaahahahah http://art.penny-arcade.com/photos/i-PZWLjW5/0/1050x10000/i-PZWLjW5-1050x10000.jpg
09:05 < aestetix> Dagmar: what is the vita?
09:06 <@Dagmar> A newer version of the Sony PSP with no media sockets.  You "buy" the games by renting them.
09:07 < aestetix> uh
09:07 < aestetix> So it's like an ipad with buttons?
09:09 <@Dagmar> No, it's more like a PSP you can never actually own
09:09 < aestetix> I mean isn't one of the points of having media sockets so that you are not limited by the console's hardware for the games you want to play?
09:09 < aestetix> wait renting?
09:09 < aestetix> you mean it autodeletes them?
09:09 <@Dagmar> No, they're DRMed
09:10 < aestetix> What does renting mean in this context? To me, renting implies a limited timespan for use
09:11 <@Dagmar> Yes.  That's the DRM.
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09:18 < aestetix> So the DRM just makes the game unplayable?
09:18 < aestetix> as opposed to deleting it?
09:18 < aestetix> If so, that's debatebly worse.
09:37 < aestetix> http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/nation-world/national/article30714762.html
09:37 < PigBot> Title: ‘Top Secret’ emails found as Clinton probe expands to key aides | McClatchy DC (at www.mcclatchydc.com)
09:38 <@Dagmar> LOL
09:38 <@Dagmar> THey in some shit now
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09:49 < aestetix> no they aren't
09:49 < aestetix> they worked for the federal government
09:49 < aestetix> they will be fine
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10:40 <@oddball> pfft.  As I said in another channel yesterday, if Holder was allowed to gracefully retire after being the first AG to be held in contempt of Congress, Clinton's going to be fine.
10:41 < aestetix> yep
10:41 < aestetix> I'd say Obama is one of the worst presidents in modern history, but he came after Bush
10:43 <@oddball> But remember, according to some (including in the press), Obama has had a scandal free administration.
10:43 < aestetix> uh
10:44 <@oddball> Yeah...
10:44 < aestetix> On paper, maybe.
10:44 <@oddball> If you burn a chunk of that paper.
10:44 < aestetix> I'll cut him a lot more slack when he closes Gitmo.
10:44 <@oddball> not gonna happen.
10:44 < aestetix> right
10:45 < aestetix> He doesn't care about election, but I'm sure he cares about what happens to him when he leaves office
10:45 <@oddball> Frankly, I'm for keeping Gitmo open because of the alternative.
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10:45 < aestetix> What is the alternative?
10:46 <@oddball> Those prisoners aren't going to be set free if we close Gitmo, they will be sent to various super-max prisons across the country.
10:46 < aestetix> I'm ok with that.
10:46 < aestetix> Unless 1. you do not have faith that our super-max prisons are any good 2. you don't think every murderer in the country wants to kill the terrorists
10:47 <@oddball> Which means that, instead of the press, international rights orgs, etc, being able to watch one place, they'll have to keep track of many places.
10:47 < aestetix> What about the scenario where one of the gitmo guys gets knifed up by someone in jail for killing children? I don't think anyone is going to cry.
10:47 <@oddball> If you're wanting to close Gitmo due to hopes of the prisoners being treated fairly, having them split up and sent to several super-max prisons is a fail.
10:48 < aestetix> That's not why I want gitmo closed.
10:48 < aestetix> I want gitmo closed so the US has to torture people on its own soil.
10:48 < aestetix> It will force them to at least be honest about it.
10:48 <@oddball> Technically Gitmo is our soil.  Just as much as any embassy is.
10:49 < aestetix> If that were true then they would be subject to our laws
10:49 <@oddball> or any of the other military bases that we own overseas.
10:49 < aestetix> That siad, I would love to see an actual trial for one of those guys
10:50 < aestetix> oddball: it's not the torture I care about, it's the dishonesty and hypocrisy of pretending the US doesn't torture when they obviously do.
10:50 <@oddball> That's not the reason they're not being treated under civilian law.  They've been branded as prisoners of war.
10:50 < aestetix> If that's true, then why does Gitmo exist?
10:51 <@oddball> aestetix: Ah, well... again, not going to change by shipping them to a super-max prison.
10:51 < aestetix> heh
10:51 < aestetix> But you get what I mean?
10:51 < aestetix> It's not the idea that the US tortures, it's the fact that nobody can fess up to it.
10:52 <@oddball> Gitmo is a military base that is far older than this issue.  It's also a convient spot that not many people really knew about and the government didn't really care about pissing off the locals by housing a bunch of terrorists.
10:53 < aestetix> So if we have other military bases, why not just transfer the inmates to them?
10:53 <@oddball> Look back to when there was serious talk about closing Gitmo.  The reps/Senators of whatever state the prisoners might be sent to pitched an unholy threat.
10:53 <@oddball> s/threat/fit
10:54 <@oddball> Because we actually give a shit about our relations with those countries.
10:55 <@oddball> Example: Germany would be pissed if it discovered that we shipped a bunch of suspected terrorists to Ramstien.
11:00 < aestetix> heh
11:01 < aestetix> Well on the plus side in a few decades there will be no prisoners left there :p
11:02 <@oddball> Yeah... except, as we saw with Obama, presidents tend to like the idea of being able to hold people indefinitely without charge/trial.
11:02 <@oddball> Hell, I remember Obama not being happy that his administration's power didn't go far enough.
11:03 < aestetix> FDR complained about that too, even though he had Congress on a leash :p
11:03 <@oddball> ans SCOTUS, for that matter.
11:03 <@oddball> s/ans/and
11:04 < k3ymkr> What I really don't get is wtf happened to Obama
11:04 < k3ymkr> He was all "Close Gitmo; Repeal Patriot"
11:04 <@oddball> ...and then he got into office?
11:04 < k3ymkr> yeah
11:04 < k3ymkr> So was he lying?
11:04 < k3ymkr> Did he learn what's really going on that they just can't tell us about?
11:04 <@oddball> Simple, he's a lying liar who lies and likes having power.
11:04 < aestetix> oddball: no he didn't
11:04 < aestetix> that was the whole point of the court packing plan
11:05 <@oddball> after he threatened to pack the court, SCOTUS folded like a cheap suit.
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11:06 < k3ymkr> It's pretty disheartening to me.
11:06 < k3ymkr> More than anything, I want to remove the patriot act, stop spying on our own citizens, and try to be the country I believe we want to be.
11:07 < k3ymkr> How can we achieve that when our candidates that say they will do that, won't?
11:07 < aestetix> oddball: what is scary is that I have talked with folks who grew up in the GDR and say that the NSA is doing exactly what the stasi was doing
11:07 <@oddball> Stop re-electing them after they show their true colors?
11:07 < aestetix> the difference is that the NSA is in the background
11:07 < k3ymkr> I mean a country that actually believes in freedom for its citizens (I don't mean patriotism)
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11:08 <@oddball> aestetix: Yep.  I know a guy that grew up in the Soviet Union, and he's recognizing a lot of this.
11:08 < k3ymkr> aestetix: I know.  I grew up thinking the USSR was this terrible place where you'd be spied on by the goverment and if you stepped out of line you could be disappeared
11:08 < k3ymkr> And yeah, that's happening here.
11:08 <@oddball> Smae here.
11:08 < aestetix> Example, one of my friends not only grew up in the GDR, but he has a collection of 1200 pages of documents that the Stasi had on him.
11:08 < aestetix> Surveillance, trying to trick him into doing things, etc.
11:08 <@oddball> wow
11:09 < aestetix> And he says the NSA is very, very familiar.
11:09 < k3ymkr> And the really sad thing is, I know at least a computer is reading what I'm saying
11:09 < k3ymkr> Which that's enough to not make us free.
11:09 < aestetix> oddball: needless to say, living in Berlin has been very eye-opening.
11:10 < aestetix> Comparing the NSA to the Nazis is not valid. Comparing them to the Stasi is completely valid.
11:10 < k3ymkr> If I'm afraid the goverment is reading what I'm saying, am I really free to speak my mind?
11:10 <@oddball> aestetix: yep
11:10 < aestetix> Except that because we have computers, they do not need to blackmail people into spying on their children/spouse/boss.
11:10 < k3ymkr> Well, yes, I am.  Fuck them :)
11:10 <@oddball> BUt remember, it's for your safety, and you don't want the terrorists to win, do you?
11:11 < k3ymkr> I'm not sure it really is safety.
11:11 < aestetix> I actually want to go to a lawyer conference of some sort in the US and bring this up.
11:11 < aestetix> When I went to CFP last year, I pissed off a bunch of lawyers by calling them on their bullshit.
11:11 < k3ymkr> But if it is, no, I would rather take risk in exchange for freedom
11:11 <@oddball> k3ymkr: You clearly support terrorism, and not freedom.
11:11 < k3ymkr> I'm also aware I'm preaching in a church here.
11:11 < k3ymkr> Just annoyed by this recently.
11:12 < aestetix> (this is also why I'm interested in the bible.... it's fascinating to me how words can be twisted so far over the years.... the same shit that results in the religious right, is happening to the US legal system)
11:12 < k3ymkr> I work with the ex head of NCIS and we get into some debates a lot.  I need to take it out on him
11:12 <@oddball> heh
11:13 < aestetix> k3ymkr: perhaps you should ask.... if we need all this government surveillance, why don't we get rid of direct election of senators?
11:13 < k3ymkr> He's a fed.  Goverment is always right
11:13 < aestetix> Since we can trust the government more than the people, right? ;)
11:13 <@oddball> Yeah... my dad is like that.  "well, they need to infringe on your rights a bit..."
11:14 < aestetix> oddball: you see the point of that question though, right?
11:14 <@oddball> basically, he's ok with the government doing whatever the fuck they want until it does something bad directly to him.
11:15 <@oddball> aestetix: The trusting the gov. more than the people?  Yep.
11:15 < aestetix> oddball: then ask if he thinks we should repeal the 17th amendment.
11:16 < aestetix> I would love to hear his reaction to that. k3ymkr your friend too :)
11:16 <@oddball> Oh, I honestly have no idea how he feels about that.  I know some folks that would like us to return to the state governments appointing Senators.
11:18 < k3ymkr> I don't think my friend cares about that.  Whatever amount of surveillance that occurs is always the right amount
11:18 < k3ymkr> He thinks everyone is guilty of something
11:18 < k3ymkr> So, who cares.
11:18 < aestetix> uh
11:18 <@oddball> Which, in fairness, is the closest to the British House of Lords/House of Commons that we can get.
11:19 < aestetix> k3ymkr: so perhaps he would be ok with getting a tattoo of his salary on his forehead?
11:19 <@oddball> k3ymkr: ah, so he's a facist.
11:19 < k3ymkr> He's probably the most far right person I know on this topic.
11:19 < k3ymkr> aestetix: Only the goverment should know, not us.
11:19 < aestetix> k3ymkr: he must not be a fan of Thomas Jefferson.
11:20 < k3ymkr> oddball: You're right.  I've never really thought of it that way, but yes.
11:20 < k3ymkr> You think he'd be offended if I called him that?
11:20 < k3ymkr> aestetix: Maybe his idea of him, but yeah, no.
11:20 <@oddball> Probably, but it's accurate.
11:20 < aestetix> k3ymkr: ask him if he's a fan of William F Buckley
11:20 < k3ymkr> I might ask him if he thinks he is
11:21 < k3ymkr> I'm not in the office today.
11:21 < aestetix> Buckley was the darling of the republican party, but he would hate what the US government is like now.
11:21 < k3ymkr> I just watched citizen 4 on the way back from Defcon, so I want to ask him somethings about that.
11:22 < aestetix> heh what did you think of that
11:22 < k3ymkr> Honestly, I was a bit surprised by Snowden's self sacrificing stand
11:22 < k3ymkr> I'd kind of had mixed feelings about his actions..I think he does too
11:23  * aestetix nods
11:23 < k3ymkr> But after watching it, I understood a bit better where he was coming from.
11:23 < aestetix> Have you seen the talk he did at HOPE? :)
11:23 < k3ymkr> Yes
11:23 < k3ymkr> I've seen a few interviews with him
11:24 < k3ymkr> I think a part of me felt he was doing it for fame, or for lols
11:24 < k3ymkr> but after watching it, I definitely thought that was out :)
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14:20 <@Evilpig> "Trigger warnings became particularly prevalent in self-help and feminist forums, where they allowed readers who had suffered from traumatic events like sexual assault to avoid graphic content that might trigger flashbacks or panic attacks."   Fuckin' feminists ruin everything
14:20 <@Evilpig> http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/09/the-coddling-of-the-american-mind/399356/
14:20 < PigBot> Title: How Trigger Warnings Are Hurting Mental Health on Campus - The Atlantic (at www.theatlantic.com)
14:29 < _NSAKEY> Evilpig: You've just stumbled on the best way to troll anyone who talks about trigger warnings in a serious manner.
14:29 < _NSAKEY> You should try bringing that sort of thing up to one of them face to face one time. You can almost see the sparks shooting out of their necks.
14:31 <@Evilpig> oh this has all sorts of great quotes to shut their stupid faces up
14:32 <@Evilpig> I love this one  “The presumption that students need to be protected rather than challenged in a classroom is at once infantilizing and anti-intellectual.”
14:33 < _NSAKEY> Hahahahahahahahaha.
14:33 < _NSAKEY> See, I didn't even click. I just typed back based on PigBot's title spam.
14:33 <@Evilpig> it's actually a nice read
14:34 < _NSAKEY> Trigge warnings are such a joke to me that I've decided that I'm going to incorporate a joke "TRIGGER WARNING" slide into as many presentations as possible now.
14:34 <@Evilpig> as you should
14:36 < _NSAKEY> Here's an example from something I plan to do at NLUG in the next few months: https://abigisp.com/images/tor-trigger-warning.png
14:41 <@Evilpig> https://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m4gfeeaNAa1qlcru4o1_500.gif
14:41 <@Evilpig> that's all I gotta say about that
14:55 <@Evilpig> ROFL  https://www.dropbox.com/s/457ofd3fagc4r84/Screen%20Shot%202015-08-12%20at%202.55.03%20PM.png?dl=0
15:13 <@Evilpig> okay someone explain this...  "The new system utilizes an optical line terminal (OLT) capable of generating four wavelengths of light, each of which is able to transmit at an eye-watering 10Gbps down and 2.5Gbps up"  http://www.engadget.com/2015/08/11/verizon-tests-new-fiber-system-that-hits-10-gbps-speeds/
15:13 < PigBot> Title: Verizon tests new fiber system that hits 10Gbps speeds (at www.engadget.com)
15:14 <@Evilpig> is this written by someone that's an idiot and just repeating the company line or did they actually come up with some system that isn't symetrical?
15:15 <@opticron> yeah, I saw that yesterday or so and was kind of confused by it
15:38 < k3ymkr> Evilpig: Light goes faster down due to gravity
15:38 < k3ymkr> Everyone knows that.
15:39 <@Evilpig> k3ymkr: makes perfect sense, how did i not see that as the answer
15:43 < k3ymkr> Happy to help
16:13 <@Evilpig> Dagmar: did you know about this?  https://www.dropbox.com/s/fadthakb01kw6eh/Screen%20Shot%202015-08-12%20at%204.12.16%20PM.png?dl=0
16:13 <@Evilpig> hot damn! it's in steam as cross platform now
16:13 <@Evilpig> about time
16:15 <@Evilpig> seems much faster now that no wine trickery is involved
17:43 <@Evilpig> well this explains why my fan remote just suddenly stopped working.  
17:43 <@Evilpig> https://goo.gl/photos/3GXd6mW7ouKoVH4bA
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19:56 <@Dagmar> Evilpig: You've been running that on a Mac all this time?
20:12 < _NSAKEY> Do you guys have any suggestions for a template for an intentionally ugly business website?
20:20 <@Dagmar> Use Times New Roman and the old HP OpenVue color palette
20:20 <@Dagmar> ...although Comic Sans might be more apropos with those colors
20:45 < _NSAKEY> Do modern browsers still do blink tags, or no?
20:48 <@brimstone> nope
20:48 <@Evilpig> Dagmar: yeah.  heh.
20:48 <@brimstone> they do marqueue though _NSAKEY
20:48 <@brimstone> _NSAKEY: Yevette's Bridal
20:48 < _NSAKEY> Oh, this is ugly.
20:48 < _NSAKEY> I don't want it to be too ugly though, because I want viewers to actually read the content.
20:49 < _NSAKEY> I'm aiming more for early 2000s business with an ugly but not terrible website.
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21:23 <@Dagmar> Damn.
21:24 <@Dagmar> China had a little bit of an explosion today
21:24 <@Dagmar> The equivalent of 21 _tons_ of TNT?  Sheesh
22:03 <@oddball> Damn... some serious ordinance went off, or did a building explode?
22:04 <@Dagmar> Literally a warehouse full of _explosives_ blew up
22:04 <@Dagmar> There are videos all over Reddit and the interwebs right now
22:04 <@Dagmar> To say the explosion was "unthinkably massive" is even an understatement
22:05 <@Dagmar> There's security cam footage of a lobby with large polyglass doors that was apparently very close to the source
22:05 <@Dagmar> ...and a Chinese dude who is just having the worst day ever, but there definitely won't be any worse days to come for him
22:06 <@oddball> Of course, apparently the British thought that 22,000lbs bomb was "medium capacity" in WWII: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Slam_%28bomb%29
22:06 < PigBot> Title: Grand Slam (bomb) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at en.wikipedia.org)
22:07 <@oddball> Official designation of the Grand Slam bomb: "Bomb, Medium Capacity, 22,000lb."
22:08 <@oddball> Of course, that was also a bomb designed to effectively create earthquakes...
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--- Log closed Thu Aug 13 00:00:26 2015