--- Log opened Tue May 26 00:00:00 2015
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01:00 <@Dagmar> Okay.
01:01 <@Dagmar> All I have to say about this is this... "Stoner logic"
01:01 <@Dagmar> http://www.scrippsmedia.com/newschannel5/now-trending/Weed-infused-k-cups-have-just-made-it-more-convenient-to-be-a-stoner-304670061.html
01:01 < PigBot`> Title: Weed-infused K-Cups have just made it more convenient to be a stoner - NewsChannel5.com (at www.scrippsmedia.com)
01:01 <@Dagmar> I cannot even fathom how this is supposed to have made sense to someone
01:32 < aestetix> jesus
01:32 < aestetix> https://twitter.com/geekeasy/status/603026371460272128
01:32 < PigBot`> Title: Adam Katz on Twitter: "My god! This "free speech unit" is perhaps the most Orwellian thing Ive ever seen. #Oakland http://t.co/fFq5xmYtJt" (at twitter.com)
01:35 <@Dagmar> Jesus christ
01:35 <@Dagmar> Someone should lose their job over that
02:29 < RangerZ> wow...thats fucking weird
02:35 < RangerZ> part of me wishes the FOP didn't have as much political power as it did
02:38 < RangerZ> b/c a lot of politicians know things are fucked up, but won't do shit :/
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02:53 <@Dagmar> All I'm going to say about this is that it's a default sub for reddit
02:53 <@Dagmar> http://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/379f28/since_its_animal_genitalia_day_on_reddit_here_is/
02:53 < PigBot`> Title: Since it's animal genitalia day on Reddit, here is the University of Florida Animal Sciences Building. The front lawn is adorned with 4 large statues of animal penises. : WTF (at www.reddit.com)
02:53 <@Dagmar> I've already looked.  It's a portal in Ingress.
02:53 <@Dagmar> ...except some exceptionally humorless individual submitted it as "Animal Sciences Scupture"
03:09 < RangerZ> lol
03:10 < RangerZ> ok... 'git status' shouldn't take more than 10 seconds to return
03:10 < RangerZ> even if the android emulator was starting....
03:10 < RangerZ> lol
03:11 < RangerZ> ohh Dagmar I pinged you last night/this morning but you might not have seen
03:11 < RangerZ> did you ever get gradle to partially compile/compile on the fly/whatever they wanna call it, to make compiles of android not take forever?
03:12 <@Dagmar> Yeah it does that but I don't trust it
03:12 <@Dagmar> Hopefully they'll have fixed whatever bugs were in it the next time I forget to start with a make clean
03:12 < RangerZ> b/c my compiles were taking a minute + where as on eclipse it was <5 seconds
03:12 < RangerZ> a new version of intelleJ just came out
03:12 < RangerZ> so new plugin
03:12 <@Dagmar> You remember me mentioning wonko packages
03:13 <@Dagmar> Like some index was being corrupted and the APK was getting it's files all screwed up
03:13 < RangerZ> something about it, just that you'd get 'old' versions of packages or something
03:13 < RangerZ> ouch
03:14 <@Dagmar> One of the more disturbing symptoms was _obviously_ some kind of broken index
03:14 <@Dagmar> When you drag a widget from the appdrawer, it's supposed to use the thumbnail image to make the floater your finger drags
03:15 <@Dagmar> ...except when I had a cooked package, it would pick some _other_ image from the package to use for the floater
03:15 <@Dagmar> I would look at it and say "WTF.  Why is it a '4'?"
03:16 <@Dagmar> ...and it was clearly using old objects, or perhaps just not replacing the right objects, because I'd make some quick bugfix (I seldom get _fixes_ wrong) and the package would still exhibit the bug I was trying to kill
03:16 <@Dagmar> Either way it takes about 35 seconds to compile the widgets package
03:19 <@Dagmar> On the subject of that inner classes thing, I'm still working on it.  My only guesses so far is someone forgetting to make a deconstructor or just failing to do away with old data properly
03:19 < RangerZ> yeah, thats much longer than I'm used to with eclipse/and
03:19 < RangerZ> huh?
03:19 < RangerZ> ohh I _might_ know
03:19 <@Dagmar> You gave Elonka a question at the last meeting
03:20 < RangerZ> ohh
03:20 <@Dagmar> ....and I'm like, how the hell do people leak memory accidentally?
03:20 < RangerZ> yeah, thats not 'quite' right
03:20 <@Dagmar> ...but them I'm also super freakin' picky about that stuff
03:20 < RangerZ> the thing is, classes in java that aren't static contain an automatic explicit reference to their outer class instance
03:20 <@Dagmar> I'm guessing there's some inobvious way to make it happen that I'm not seeing yet but I'll get there
03:21 <@Dagmar> Yeah but wouldn't you have to new something into existance and then fail to ever dispose of it/
03:21 < RangerZ> which means, that if you use an anonymous inner class from an activity, that activity can't be Garbage collected, even when it should be
03:21 <@Dagmar> Ahhh
03:21 < RangerZ> this is only an issue when you're doing background processing, etc
03:22 <@Dagmar> Yeah there's all kinds of warnings about anonymous inner classes
03:23 < RangerZ> the ONLY correct way to handle it (and doug even called Doug Lea) about it, and he said to use WeakReference<OuterClass> mReference = new WeakReference<OuterClass>(outerInstance);
03:23 < RangerZ> and Doug Lea wrote .... http://grepcode.com/file/repository.grepcode.com/java/root/jdk/openjdk/6-b14/java/util/concurrent/ThreadPoolExecutor.java
03:23 < PigBot`> Title: GC: ThreadPoolExecutor - java.util.concurrent.ThreadPoolExecutor (.java) - GrepCode Class Source (at grepcode.com)
03:23 < RangerZ> the entire java.util.concurrent package
03:23 < RangerZ> lol
03:24 < RangerZ> thats why lambdas are nice/not nice, b/c they do the same thing, however they are the -same- scope as the outer reference
03:24 < RangerZ> whereas anon inner classes are a new smaller scope
03:25 < RangerZ> which is why you can only use 'final' or static fields
03:26 < RangerZ> believe me, I spent like a week looking for the right answer/cause for the errors we were getting in Eclipse
03:26 < RangerZ> the ERROR is really good, but... doesn't tell you how to actually 'fix' it
03:33 <@Dagmar> Luckily for me I wouldn't quite know how to declare an anonymous inner without directly attaching it to someting
03:38 < RangerZ> that doesn't matter
03:38 < RangerZ> that still 'count'
03:38 < RangerZ> if you want, I can make a pass through your code some time, and take a look for any concurrency issues I see
03:39 < RangerZ> (prevent future issues that you might not have ran into yet
03:39 < RangerZ> etc
03:39 < RangerZ> you aren't using gitlab are you?
03:39 < RangerZ> great way to setup private repo(s) that you can grant access to
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04:41 < aestetix> ok, anyone here good with sql?
04:42 < RangerZ> I'm good with the theory behind it, and table design/etc, not so much 'specific' SQL server instructions
04:42 < RangerZ> so it depends on what  you need
04:48 < RangerZ> ?
04:51 < aestetix> sorry in a twitter argument
04:52 < RangerZ> ohh btw, that pic of 'free speech unit' is fake apparently, I figured as much, but did some googling and its not real
04:52 < RangerZ> the rest of the pic is 'real' though :/
05:00 < RangerZ> ok... THAT was weird
05:00 < RangerZ> had to modprobe -r psmouse and modprobe psmouse to get mouse to work again....
05:00 < RangerZ> except it -was- working for selection of apps
05:00 < RangerZ> just not IN apps
05:00 < RangerZ> odd
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11:14 <@rattle> Some people have way too much spare time and power.  http://www.righto.com/2015/05/bitcoin-mining-on-55-year-old-ibm-1401.html
11:14 < PigBot`> Title: Bitcoin mining on a 55 year old IBM 1401 mainframe: 80 seconds per hash (at www.righto.com)
11:59 <@Evilpig> Dagmar: do you know of a way to block a USB device from loading under linux?  I have the vendor and product id, but not sure where I can black list them fi that's even possible like you can regular pci devices
11:59 <@Evilpig> idVendor=0424 idProduct=4060
12:06 < RangerZ> Evilpig: I actually ran into this once... but I forget how to deal with it offhand
12:06 < RangerZ> but yes you need those Ids
12:08 <@Evilpig> I got it
12:08 <@Evilpig> make a file in /etc/udev/rules.d/
12:08 <@Evilpig> called it disable-usb-device.rules
12:08 <@Evilpig> ACTION=="add", ATTR{idVendor}=="0424", ATTR{idProduct}=="4060", RUN="/bin/sh -c 'echo 0 >/sys/\$devpath/authorized'"
12:10 <@Mirage> Evilpig: I'd guess modprobe blacklisting it
12:10 <@Mirage> udev works too.
12:12 <@Mirage> You have an easy one..just blacklisting.  I had fun trying to figure out how to get the os to use my firefly as a remote for lirc while  blocking x11 from snatching it up and using it as a keyboard
12:23 <@Evilpig> this is just an annoyance
12:23 <@Evilpig> when we leave the crash carts connected they have issues installing shit because the sd reader shows up as sda
12:23 <@Evilpig> why...  I have no clue.  but if I can get them to blacklist it then we can be assholes and leave carts connected 
12:54 < RangerZ> Evilpig's goal every day:  "try to be more of an asshole"
13:04  * aestetix yawns
13:29 <@Mirage> RangerZ: Goal achieved!
13:34 < RangerZ> ?
13:34 < RangerZ> no
13:34 < RangerZ> he needs to kick it up a notch
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13:47 < aestetix> RangerZ: the easiest way Evilpig could do that is by deleting Tumblr.
13:47 < RangerZ> aestetix: lets be honest, gathering up all the tween girls and centrally controlling them is MUCH better for the rest of the internet
13:48 < RangerZ> wouldn't you hate to have tumblr users all over reddit, or somewhere else
13:48 < RangerZ> ;) lol
13:49 < aestetix> true
13:49 < v4mp> anyone used the newer versions of androidstudio?  every few months I feel like seeing if it actually has become usable... but almost invariably return to eclipse...
13:49 < aestetix> So I can just blacklist *.tumblr.com
13:49 < aestetix> So tumblr is sort of like a digital adult day care?
13:54 < RangerZ> yeah
14:00 < RangerZ> aestetix: not as easy as you'd think
14:01 < RangerZ> a lot of -real- people have been moving their -persona- pages to tumblr for .....SOME .... reason
14:01 < RangerZ> (I'm guessing just free hosting
14:01 < RangerZ> and big viewership)
14:01 < aestetix> so a few edge cases have to suffer
14:02 < aestetix> tumblr is like if geocities had an abortion
14:02 < RangerZ> no
14:02 < RangerZ> abortions CAN be for the greater good
14:02 < RangerZ> thats an insult to abortions
14:14 <@Mirage> Saw a BMW in the parking garage today with the personalized plate "PASHIN".
14:14 <@Mirage> I was about to snap a pic, then I realised the owner was just getting out of the car.
14:19 <@klixa> RangerZ: rarely tho...they are usually just a messed up form of birth control
14:19 < RangerZ> i said 'can'
14:19 <@klixa> and i said rarely...
14:20 <@klixa> so whats pashin mean
14:28 <@Dagmar> v4mp: I've been using AS just fine
14:36 < v4mp> ok, thanks!  when it first came out a few years back like 0.1 alpha, I remember having intermittent issues with gradle and junk... which is why I felt like asking when u mentioned gradle
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14:40 <@Mirage> RangerZ: aestetix parents already missed the opportunity to prove that true
14:43 <@Mirage> In case I miss when klixa comes back, point out that, though there _may_ be some valid reason for 'PASHIN', odds are more likely that it was a spelling fail.
14:46 < _NSAKEY> Mirage: It's not too late. They can still fly to Berlin and make up for their mistake.
15:00 <@northrup> Mirage: don't let the owner being there stop you, custom plates means he wanted the attention right?
15:01 <@northrup> (or she!)
15:09 < aestetix> what does pashin mean
15:12 <@northrup> I'm with Mirage, more than likely a spelling fail.
15:47 <@Dagmar> If they complain just say "Look, man.  I've got a fetish but it's under control, so lay off." an then walk away
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16:26 <@Dagmar> Wow.
16:26 <@Dagmar> The standard for pre-screening questions has gotten really low
16:26 <@Dagmar> They asked me the difference between ssh and telnet
16:26 <@Dagmar> o.O
16:27 <@Dagmar> If that werne't a video call and I could see the interviewer's face, I might have suspected it was a joke question
16:32 < v4mp> LOL
16:32 <@Dagmar> At this point I could honestly say I was probably using ssh before the interviewer became interested in the gender of their preference
16:33 <@Dagmar> We just plain _stopped_ using telnet for anything but MUDs when ssh came out
16:33 <@Dagmar> They asked me how to kill X if it became unresponsive
16:34 <@Dagmar> ...and they asked me something that I'm pretty sure *has* to be a function of whatever IME the DE is using
16:34 <@Dagmar> "What happens if you press ALT-9 and then M."
16:34 <@Dagmar> The console doesn't care about that stuff at all
16:34 <@Dagmar> Of that I am relatively certain
16:34 <@Dagmar> Surely I'd have encountered that being used at least _once_ by now
16:37 < aestetix> hmm does github have a filesize limit on repos?
16:39 < aestetix> yes, it sure does
16:39 <@Mirage> I would guess it's somewhere around the quota limit or free disk space...whichever is hit first
16:40 <@Mirage> oh, github..nevermind I was thinking GitLab
16:41 < aestetix> 100 megs
16:53 <@northrup> Dagmar: was this some place in town?
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17:20 <@Dagmar> northrup: Yeah
17:21 <@Dagmar> Jesus.  Okay... this battery is a bit much
17:21 <@Dagmar> http://www.amazon.com/YY-Store-50000MAh-Portable-lightning-Blackberry/dp/B00KTUPF9C/ref=pd_rhf_se_s_cp_4_EP46?ie=UTF8&refRID=1B72SBPGJNM4D4QY0FYA
17:21 <@Dagmar> 50,000mAh
17:22 <@northrup> Yeah... the reviews aren't kind though...
17:22 <@northrup> pointing to weak cell choice for battery it looks like
17:23 <@Dagmar> Yeah, I think so too
17:23 <@Dagmar> I'm looking at some (well, it's hard to be cheaper) smaller ones from wirelessoemshop
17:23 <@Dagmar> I just wnat to be able to run a Pi under load for about four hours with them
17:24 <@Dagmar> 2200mAh seems to be good for about two hours or so
17:26 <@northrup> Man - somewhere I saw where a guy had a solar setup with battery and a pi inclosed in a field somewhere.
17:26 <@Evilpig> northrup: notlarry was working on something like that
17:26 <@northrup> Evilpig: thanks! that does ring the bell!
17:28 <@Evilpig> how odd...  https://www.humblebundle.com/
17:28 < PigBot`> Title: Humble Nindie Bundle presented by Nintendo eShop (pay what you want and help charity) (at www.humblebundle.com)
17:29 <@Dagmar> northrup: Yeah I would prefer these be somewhat hideable in a car, so solar is out this time
17:33 <@Evilpig> that's not shady at all
17:34 <@Dagmar> It's better than shady.  It's vicious
17:34 < v4mp> newtrent 12ks are nice
17:34 <@Dagmar> Anyone showing up for the anomaly in June is going to have their phone bugging them about open wireless, and when they connect, they will be shown all the cheating that's been going on
17:35 <@Evilpig> lol
17:35 <@northrup> lol
17:35 <@Dagmar> Since Niantic refuses to enforce their own rules, I'm going to show the thing for the massive shitshow that it is
17:35 <@Evilpig> btw, did laughingboy hit you up about android dev?
17:36 <@Dagmar> I've got screenshots of four of them going into cemeteries in the wee hours three times already this week
17:36 <@Dagmar> Nope
17:36 <@Evilpig> they thought they had me on that
17:36 <@Evilpig> but little did they know I could reach points into there from the movie theater and gas station
17:39 <@Evilpig> https://twitter.com/RobDenBleyker/status/603305922442563584
17:39 < PigBot`> Title: Rob DenBleyker on Twitter: "Something interesting to think about: Is a toilet just a chair that you poop on, or is a chair just a toilet that you dont poop on?" (at twitter.com)
17:40 < aestetix> does anyone know how a controller works? a money controller
17:40 < aestetix> Like what is the procedure for dishing out a paycheck
17:41 <@Evilpig> submit request, receive check, profit
17:41 < aestetix> thats' what I thought
17:41 < aestetix> so why does it take forever
17:42 <@northrup> How big is the company?
17:42 <@Evilpig> because asshats like you submit requests for checks that they aren't supposed to get.  I would too but I lack the motivation
17:42 <@northrup> some times they have arbitrary policies about when checks are cut
17:42 < aestetix> northrup: actually it's a third party controller that handles who knows how many companies
17:42 <@Evilpig> in that case see northrup's point about schedules
17:43 <@Evilpig> banks are dicks with fees and some of that shit is dictated by batch processing to save money
17:43 < aestetix> ^ -- why I use a credit union
17:43 <@northrup> my favorite "oh you're fucking kidding" is when I did some contract work for a sizeable sum for someone and they cut me a check, took it down to the bank
17:43 <@Evilpig> 6 of one....
17:44 <@northrup> but the bank wouldn't cache it because they hadn't called in the check number as being a valid issued check yet...
17:44 <@northrup> so the bank thought i stole a check
17:44 <@Evilpig> didn't you?
17:44 <@Dagmar> It's literally a batch processing deal, so someone has to sit down and make sure all the numbers at up before and after
17:44 <@northrup> well I don't see why we need to talk about the details Evilpig....
17:45 < aestetix> Dagmar: isn't that what spreadsheets are for?
17:45 <@Dagmar> It would be incredibly inefficient to have them doing that all in tiny amounts around the clock
17:45 <@Evilpig> you know damn well why.  you didn't get us checks too
17:45 <@Evilpig> dick
17:45 <@Dagmar> aestetix: Trusting spreadsheets alone is how money magically "goes missing"
17:45 <@northrup> LOL
17:46 < _NSAKEY> northrup: Not surprising. One of the local title loan places got bilked out of about $30,000 in 2 weeks.
17:46 <@Dagmar> Unlike many other professions, accountants tend to like to manually inspect endless rows and columns of numbers
17:46 < _NSAKEY> They used those check printing kits you can buy from any office supply store.
17:46 <@Dagmar> _NSAKEY; Hooray for whoever stole it from them
17:46 < _NSAKEY> Someone came in and did a loan, got one of those checks, then copied the routing numbers and went on a buying spree around town.
17:46 <@Evilpig> _NSAKEY: I actually support that crime
17:47 <@Evilpig> fuck those loan sharks
17:47 < _NSAKEY> The bank didn't start catching it until 2-3 weeks after it started.
17:47 < _NSAKEY> That business is about to get even more fucked up.
17:47 < _NSAKEY> Title loans, as we know them here, are going to go away.
17:47 < _NSAKEY> But what replaced them will probably be worse.
17:47 <@Dagmar> That's a fuckin' GOOD thing
17:47 < _NSAKEY> Because there's no caps on the money, and they can actually get judgements when they don't get paid.
17:47 <@Dagmar> It used to be that seeing a bunch of liquor stores meant your neighborhood was turning into a ghetto
17:48 <@Dagmar> Now it's usurious title loan and payday advance places
17:48 < _NSAKEY> As it stands now, title loans are non-recourse.
17:48 <@Dagmar> Yeah they just threaten to take your car
17:48 < _NSAKEY> So Bob could get a title loan from Alice at Wonderland Cash Services, then crush the car at Eve's Junk Yard.
17:48 <@Dagmar> Oh you might be interested in knowing this...
17:48 < _NSAKEY> Alice can't do much of anything.
17:49 <@Dagmar> Someone stole the title out of the glove box of the beemer I used to drive
17:49 < _NSAKEY> Yeah, but even if Alice takes Bob's car, Bob isn't liable for any deficiency in the balance.
17:49 <@Dagmar> They used it to get a loan from a place just down Charlotte a bit
17:49 <@Mirage> Dagmar: why was the title in your glovebox?
17:49 <@Dagmar> ...then they tried to tell me that *they* owned *my* car and were going to take it
17:49 < _NSAKEY> Let's say Bob owes $3,000, and his car only sells for $1,000. Bob does not owe any money.
17:49 < _NSAKEY> But with the changes being made, Alice could go after Bob for the remaining balance.
17:50 <@Dagmar> Mirage: Because that's where it was and it's not a pink slip.  Simple possession of the title document doesn't mean fuckin' much
17:51 < _NSAKEY> Dagmar: If you believe that, you should get your full name, DOB, and social security number tattooed on your forehead.
17:51 <@Dagmar> There was about a fifteen minute wait after I made it clear I was willing to demolish the office by hand and *then* call the police to report their attempt at stealing my car before they handed my title back
17:51 < _NSAKEY> Hahahaha.
17:52 <@Dagmar> I didn't sign any of that paperwork, and they were dumb enough not to check things carefully
17:52 < _NSAKEY> Dagmar: They can't do much of anything in that case.
17:52 <@Dagmar> THey should have never let that deal happen in the first place, but someone got greedy and what's legitimately mine is going to damn well stay mine
17:52 < _NSAKEY> Most of those stores are squeamish about even going after blatant fraud cases.
17:52 <@Dagmar> _NSAKEY: Yeah they *tried* to bluff me
17:52 <@Evilpig> w00t!
17:52 <@Evilpig> Loop 1/10: Stuck Address       : ok Random Value        : ok Compare XOR         : ok Compare SUB         : ok Compare MUL         : ok Compare DIV         : ok Compare OR          : ok Compare AND         : ok Sequential Increment: ok Solid Bits          : ok Block Sequential    : ok Checkerboard        : ok Bit Spread          : ok Bit Flip            : ok Walking Ones        : ok Walking Zeroes      : ok
17:52 <@Evilpig>  8bit  Writes        : ok 16-bit Writes       : ok
17:53 <@Evilpig> memory check came back clean on the new dimm
17:53 <@Dagmar> cool
17:53 <@northrup> ]w00t!
17:53 < _NSAKEY> Dagmar: I bet that didn't go well. Probably about like yelling at a Comcast rep or someone behind the counter at McDonald's, right?
17:53 < _NSAKEY> I mean, it sounds like it turned out in your favor.
17:53 <@Evilpig> if y'all haven't used it.  memtester is about as efficient as memtest
17:53 <@Evilpig> [root@plex wilbur]# memtester 6G 10
17:53 <@Evilpig> memtester version 4.2.1 (64-bit)
17:53 < _NSAKEY> But I mean in terms of the intelligence of the people you dealt with.
17:54 <@Dagmar> _NSAKEY: More like having the cashier at McDonalds tell you that you owe them $2,200 if you want the burger you bought from Burger King back
17:54 <@Dagmar> I was _not_ nice about it after the first few minutes
17:54 < _NSAKEY> Yeah, no need to be.
17:54 <@Dagmar> The moment it was clear they were trying to lie to me, I made it clear what kind of mayhem I was about to wreak
17:55 <@Dagmar> Smiling at everyone _but_ the office manager
17:55 <@northrup> Is there NO checking that the title slip that they're putting up matches a VIN of a vehicle IN the parking lot?
17:55 <@Dagmar> I already hated those places, but to have one try and subject me to that kind of skullduggery... wow
17:56 <@Dagmar> northrup: No idea what the hell they thought they were doing there
17:57 <@Dagmar> Whoever it was gave them a bogus number
17:57 <@Dagmar> They wound up calling me after getting my info from the DMV or title clerks somewhere
17:58 <@Dagmar> I made sure they had the right name, made them reiterate what they were telling me, and then asked where they were.  "I'll be down there in just a few minutes to sort this out.  What's your manager's name?"
17:58 <@Dagmar> He restated they wanted me to pay the money or they'd take my car, I told him point blank it was my car and they were defrauded
17:59 <@Dagmar> He openly dismissed that as being something he didn't care about and that they could file against my car no matter what
17:59 <@northrup> da fuq... see you in court bastards
17:59 <@Dagmar> I pointed out that there were three desks in the room and three large glass windows, and that I was pretty sure I could get them through those windows without scratching the frame, "...and then I'll move onto other things"
18:00 <@Dagmar> "...so you'd better consult with your legal people about whether you want to risk me calling the cops or throwing a fit at the toss of a coin, or do you want to cut your losses and return my stolen property"
18:01 <@Dagmar> I really was about to flip a nickle.  Heads for phone call.  Tails for freakout and wonton destruction.
18:01 <@Dagmar> It's that little edge of uncertainty that really seems to bring the point across
18:02 <@Dagmar> northrup: If I'd had to go through the delay of the courts and hear them repeat any more lies, I would have hunted up a special two-tailed coin to use.
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18:11 < _NSAKEY> Dagmar: Here's an unrelated philosophical question. I've got a shell script I'm woking on making portable.
18:11 < _NSAKEY> It looks like it will be except for one line, which I can't reasonably control.
18:12 < _NSAKEY> Should I test for the platform with uname and store it as a variable, or force the user to pick their platform?
18:12 < _NSAKEY> It's literally the difference between "service ssh restart" and "service sshd restart" at this point.
18:13 < aestetix> oh god that's annoying
18:13 < _NSAKEY> Yeah, no kidding.
18:13 < _NSAKEY> I was PISSED when I saw it.
18:14 < _NSAKEY> https://github.com/NSAKEY/happy-dance/blob/master/happy-dance.sh
18:14 < PigBot`> Title: happy-dance/happy-dance.sh at master · NSAKEY/happy-dance · GitHub (at github.com)
18:14 < aestetix> How portable does it need to be?
18:14 < _NSAKEY> The ssh_server() function has some bash-specific code and I just ironed that out.
18:14 < _NSAKEY> But my problem now is that FreeBSD calls the service "sshd" while Ubuntu and Debian call it "ssh."
18:14 < _NSAKEY> aestetix: This is purely a project for fun. No paychecks involved.
18:14 < aestetix> Don't forget RHEL and CEntos
18:15 < _NSAKEY> I don't use either, so I don't care about them.
18:15 < _NSAKEY> But since you said something, I might grab a CentOS ISO just to test it.
18:17 < _NSAKEY> I'd test it on OpenIndiana or one of the other illumos distros, but it looks like they all use an older version of SunSSH.
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18:25 < RangerZ> oddball: Evilpig Dagmar and anyone else with a wii U or 3DS, there is actually Nintendo games on the Humble Bundle www.humblebundle.com
18:25 <@Evilpig> hello mr late to the party
18:26 <@Evilpig> 17:28 <@Evilpig> how odd...  https://www.humblebundle.com/
18:26 < PigBot`> Title: Humble Nindie Bundle presented by Nintendo eShop (pay what you want and help charity) (at www.humblebundle.com)
18:26 < RangerZ> ehh
18:26 < RangerZ> Mirage: nevermind, you were right, he's found a new way to be an asshole today
18:26 <@Evilpig> today?
18:27 <@Evilpig> come on... I strive for something new every day
18:30 < _NSAKEY> We could put out an "Evilpig Asshole Calendar."
18:31 < _NSAKEY> Instead of cheesy inspirational sayings, each date has IRC logs of Evilpig being mean to people.
18:31 <@Evilpig> 365 days of goatse?
18:32 < v4mp> _NSAKEY: use chkconfig
18:33 < v4mp> so, for the part where you do sudo cp $PWD/etc/ssh/sshd_config /etc/ssh/sshd_config
18:34 < v4mp> just use if [ -f $shd_config ]; type dealio to check if file exists
18:34 < v4mp> and if not do the not daemon version
18:34 < v4mp> then for service restart
18:34 < v4mp> just do
18:34 < v4mp> chkconfig sshd
18:35 < v4mp> and run list on it to see if the service exists
18:35 < _NSAKEY> chkconfig isn't installed by default on anything I happen to be touching right now.
18:35 < v4mp> or u could just do the same as the file and check like if [ -f "/etc/init.d/sshd" ]
18:36 < _NSAKEY> Yeah, I was thinking of doing that.
18:36 < v4mp> so earlier in ur code
18:36 < v4mp> can just do a one time check like that
18:36 < v4mp> and set a flag
18:36 < v4mp> and use that to determine the config copy as well as service start
18:36 < _NSAKEY> The BSD version is like /etc/rc.d/sshd.
18:36 < v4mp> ah right , ok, so yea just check for both then
18:36 < _NSAKEY> Oh, the config copy is cross-platform.
18:36 < v4mp> hm
18:36 < v4mp> OH
18:36 < v4mp> even better
18:36 < _NSAKEY> What's on github is linux-only right now.
18:37 < v4mp> if service --status-all | grep 'sshd'
18:37 < v4mp> erm
18:37 < v4mp> -qF
18:37 < v4mp> something..
18:37 < v4mp> like that
18:37 < v4mp> you can search for active server list
18:37 < _NSAKEY> But the version I'm messing with locally works on FreeBSD 10 and Ubuntu 14.04.
18:37 < _NSAKEY> I think I'm going to go with the file approach. Thanks for the input.
18:38 < _NSAKEY> Need to see how it behaves on CentOS before I get too carried away though.
18:38 < v4mp> no problem
18:38 < v4mp> yea, you might want to try doing status-all check on service
18:38 < v4mp> it should give you a complete listing of installed services
18:38 < v4mp> then you can grep for sshd
18:38 < v4mp> and use that as your flag
18:38 < _NSAKEY> I was thinking of adding an authorized_keys file with my ED25519 key for maximum laziness, but then I'd get even more jokes about chinese backdoors than I already do.
18:39 < v4mp> secp256k1 or bust
18:40 < v4mp> I think it's in libgcrypt?
18:40 < v4mp> ;P
18:40 < _NSAKEY> Just had to research that one.
18:40 < _NSAKEY> Is it used in ECDSA?
18:41 < v4mp> yea
18:41 < _NSAKEY> If so, I thought ECDSA had AIDS due to NSA influence over NIST.
18:41 < v4mp> it's satoshi's choice
18:41 < v4mp> right
18:41 < v4mp> which is why bitcoin runs on secp256k1
18:41 < v4mp> instead of the more common secp256r1
18:41 < v4mp> "allegedly"
18:42 < _NSAKEY> That whole script is really just an automated way of implementing stribika's secure secure shell guide.
18:42 < v4mp> although, tinfoil hat could lead one to believe that it's an even more nefarious diversion by nsa
18:42 < _NSAKEY> I had it to the point where it was pretty pain-free for Ubuntu and Debian boxes, but have been messing around with alternate platforms and decided to revisit it.
18:43 < v4mp> ya
18:43 < v4mp> I mean, you're ofc sitting pretty with that 4096 rsa
18:44 < _NSAKEY> Yeah, that's a good fallback position in case some form of EC crypto isn't supported.
18:44 < _NSAKEY> For example, I spent a lot of the weekend messing with OpenIndiana and Solaris 11 in VMs.
18:44 < _NSAKEY> the OpenCSW build of OpenSSH for Solaris 11 has a known bug with ED25519.
18:44 < _NSAKEY> The sshd_config works just fine otherwise.
18:45 < _NSAKEY> So, 4096-bit RSA was the solution.
18:45 < v4mp> hahaha whoaa just looked up that bug weirdd
18:46 < _NSAKEY> Yeah, I was doing like, "ssh -vvv user@solaris.box.on.my.net" to try to get meaningful output.
18:47 < v4mp> so great to have a common fallback, although on the bright side I'm sure this is a pretty simple fix for the devs
18:47 < _NSAKEY> Probably.
18:47 < _NSAKEY> I'm wondering if CentOS still includes games in the default server install.
18:48 < _NSAKEY> I remember seeing that once back in the CentOS 5 days and laughing to someone about how they were maintaining a "proud unix tradition" in keeping games on hardware like that.
18:48 < v4mp> hahaha
18:49 < v4mp> I mean, you had to have something to do after you queued your jobs.. ;P
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18:51 < _NSAKEY> That's a fair point.
19:04 < _NSAKEY> https://twitter.com/MuckRock/status/603334968056487936
19:04 < PigBot`> Title: MuckRock on Twitter: "#HillaryEmail includes lengthy exchange by aides teasing WSJs @monicalangley http://t.co/tYzvIPmaSu http://t.co/66jctRi7PK" (at twitter.com)
19:04 < _NSAKEY> "This will be exciting when it's FOIA'd."
19:37 < _NSAKEY> v4mp: One thing throws a wrench in the works for my project: systemd.
19:38 < _NSAKEY> Dirs like /etc/init.d/ don't contain init scripts anymore, although "service sshd restart" works on CentOS 7.
19:38 < _NSAKEY> It's tempting not to care, since my whole point in messing with FreeBSD was having a refuse from the inevitable stream of bugs from systemd. (Just going by the track record of the people involved)
19:40 < _NSAKEY> But on the other hand, even systemd users deserve some measure of protection against programs like BULLRUN/Edgehill.
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20:11 < v4mp> _NSAKEY: hm.. did you try listing the services?
20:12 < v4mp> I'm not on a nix box atm
20:12 < v4mp> but
20:12 < v4mp> service --status-all | grep -Fq 'sshd'
20:12 < v4mp> something like that should do it?
20:16 < aestetix> _NSAKEY: where does systemd store the init scripts?
20:16 < v4mp> ok just tried it
20:17 < v4mp> yea status all should do the trick
20:18 < v4mp> sdfs /usr/lib/systemd/scripts or something, probably
20:18 < v4mp> or systemd/system
20:19 < aestetix> What advantage does systemd bring over init?
20:19 < v4mp> and u might have symlinks in /etfc/systemd/system
20:19 < v4mp> *etc
20:19 < _NSAKEY> aestetix: Advanced trolling from Lennart Poettering.
20:20 < aestetix> huh?
20:20 < _NSAKEY> v4mp: Yeah, they're all symlinked on CentOS 7 and Ubuntu 15.04.
20:20 < _NSAKEY> I did "service sshd restart" and it worked.
20:20 < _NSAKEY> Also, "service ssh" restart worked on ubuntu.
20:20 < v4mp> hahaha
20:20 < v4mp> yea, tbh I never had a pressing need to replace init
20:20 < _NSAKEY> aestetix: He's the same asshat who cursed us with PulseAudio and other software that didn't work until he moved on and let others maintain it.
20:21 < v4mp> so not sure of the internals.. maybe years ago I read up on it but have long forgotten
20:21 < _NSAKEY> I've had to "aptget purge pulseaudio" and fall back to ALSA too many times to ever trust his code again, so I've been moving to FreeBSD for any new servers I spin up.
20:21 < v4mp> kekkkk
20:21 < _NSAKEY> *apt-get
20:22 < v4mp> yea... I felt kinda bad for the lad who ended up giving some talk a few years back about being one of the only people trying to get pulse working
20:22 < v4mp> but, yup, when in doubt with pulse, purge and revert to alsa
20:22 < _NSAKEY> But since I'm messing with this shell script's code anyway, might as well provide support for those running a systemd distro.
20:22 < _NSAKEY> I feel bad for the guy at CCC whose talk he crashed a few years ago.
20:22 < v4mp> yea so instead of looking for directories
20:22 < _NSAKEY> That guy was way too nice.
20:22 < _NSAKEY> The correct response should have been an abrupt throat punch.
20:22 < v4mp> I think that actually looking for installed services
20:23 < v4mp> is going to be the "cleaner" approach
20:23 < aestetix> lol
20:23 < v4mp> you could also do a super lulzy thing
20:23 < v4mp> and do something like run which
20:24 < v4mp> and check for returns ;P
20:24 < _NSAKEY> v4mp: That would be great, but I just tested.
20:24 < _NSAKEY> GNU service does --status-all.
20:24 < _NSAKEY> BSD service does -a.
20:24 < v4mp> :O  whoaaa learned something new today haha
20:25 < _NSAKEY> I was laughing with someone just a couple nights ago about how GNU tools vs BSD tools is like jumping between two languages that are mostly mutually intelligible, but have some subtle but maddening differences.
20:25 < v4mp> haha
20:25 < v4mp> so
20:25 < _NSAKEY> I was wrong, BSD uses service -l.
20:27 < v4mp> hmmmmmmmmmm
20:27 < _NSAKEY> GNU service --status-all output looks like this:
20:27 < _NSAKEY>  [ + ]  ssh
20:27 < v4mp> service sshd status
20:27 < v4mp> maybe check status
20:27 < v4mp> like
20:28 < v4mp> service ssh status
20:28 < _NSAKEY> root@ocean-palace ~ > service -l | grep ssh
20:28 < _NSAKEY> sshd
20:28 < _NSAKEY> ^^^ BSD service
20:28 < v4mp> ah right
20:28 < v4mp> yikes
20:29 < _NSAKEY> "service ssh status" works on both Debian Wheezy and FreeBSD 10.
20:29 < _NSAKEY> GNU service outputs this:
20:29 < _NSAKEY> [ ok ] sshd is running.
20:29 < v4mp> kk
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20:29 < v4mp> ya just tested that on a gnu system
20:29 < _NSAKEY> The BSD version's way more verbose, with what looks like tail -n 5 output at the end for good measure.
20:30 < _NSAKEY> Everything I've tested on except Debian Wheezy seems to respond to "service sshd restart" though.
20:30 < _NSAKEY> Even the systemd stuff.
20:32 < v4mp> so I guess the solution
20:33 < v4mp> is checking for service ssh or service sshd
20:33 < v4mp> and if both return neg
20:33 < v4mp> then do a check for rc.d or init.d
20:33 < _NSAKEY> Both ssh and sshd work on Debian Jessie.
20:33 < _NSAKEY> I'm gonna say that Debian Wheezy is the outlier, and probably not bother supporting it.
20:33 < v4mp> well I think it's only like one more check or something to support everything
20:34 < _NSAKEY> Everything else works with "service sshd restart," and I'm getting away from Wheezy due to its age anyway.
20:34 < v4mp> or just directly check for systemd vs init
20:34 < _NSAKEY> I had to install openssh-server from wheezy-backports just to get it to run this script.
20:34 < v4mp> so, I just checked on an army system
20:34 < v4mp> and service sshd status is unrecognized
20:34 < v4mp> *arm system
20:34 < v4mp> but service ssh status
20:34 < _NSAKEY> I was going to say, that sounds hysterically illegal.
20:34 < v4mp> yields ok sshd running
20:34 < v4mp> hahaha
20:34 < v4mp> ;P
20:34 < v4mp> freudian slip
20:35 < _NSAKEY> I'm picturing someone like the general from War Games screaming about the Russians right about now.
20:35 < v4mp> restarted ssh on the whopper
20:35 < _NSAKEY> *WOPR
20:35 < _NSAKEY> That was actually how it was stylized.
20:35 < v4mp> ;P
20:35 < v4mp> yea
20:36 < v4mp> war operation plan response?
20:36 < v4mp> something like that
20:36 < _NSAKEY> Can't remember.
20:36 < v4mp> probably generated enough heat to sufficiently cook burgers
20:36 < _NSAKEY> Sounds like a good excuse to re-watch that movie.
20:36 < v4mp> ;D
20:36 < v4mp> that is really crazy though about the service flags
20:37 < _NSAKEY> Yeah, something like that could probably power a medium-sized village in a third world country, but would be trumped by an Android burner phone from the dollar store in terms of today's raw power.
20:37 < _NSAKEY> I'm blaming Debian Wheezy for being old.
20:38 < _NSAKEY> Apparently on NetBSD, the way to do it is to run "sh /etc/rc.d/sshd restart"
20:38 < v4mp> mm old school not using service command
20:39 < v4mp> so.. hm
20:39 < v4mp> the more I think about it
20:39 < v4mp> I think that actually calling which sshd
20:39 < v4mp> is a decent way of checking
20:39 < v4mp> albeit an extremely hackish one
20:39 < _NSAKEY> Some google hit for the same thing regarding OpenBSD recommends using kill -HUP.
20:40 < v4mp> haha
20:41 < _NSAKEY> It's kind of tempting to just make restarting the sshd something the user is forced to do.
20:41 < v4mp> undoubtedly written by someone more pedantic than I
20:41 < _NSAKEY> But that's less fun.
20:41 < v4mp> kill -9 woohoo
20:42 < v4mp> yea best to not have user interaction, which is the point of your script
20:42 < _NSAKEY> I have a little user interaction.
20:42 < _NSAKEY> For example, some people might want to use passwords for their client-side ssh keys.
20:42 < _NSAKEY> On the server side, they might get scared of having all their host keys rmed and want to back out.
20:43 < v4mp> so you want to just have at the end then something like "You must now restart ssh for these changes to take effect."
20:43 < v4mp> *ssh/sshd
20:44 < _NSAKEY> That's awfully tempting.
20:44 < _NSAKEY> Then again, I might just change "service ssh restart" to "service sshd restart."
20:44 < v4mp> or you could do the subtle thing where you pkill ssh pkill sshd
20:45 < _NSAKEY> "service ssh restart" is only a requirement on Wheezy, and as I said I had to use openssh-server from wheezy-backports just to run that script.
20:45 < _NSAKEY> Hmmm.
20:45 < _NSAKEY> killall -HUP is probably universal...
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20:45 < v4mp> XD
20:45 <@Evilpig> good timing there. lol
20:46 < v4mp> last thought --> checking /usr/sbin
20:47 < v4mp> might be more universal than checking in rc.d or init.d
20:47 <@oddball> Dagmar: My god... they've made a darker black: http://modernnotion.com/this-material-is-so-black-that-you-cant-fully-understand-it/
20:47 < _NSAKEY> v4mp: Even Debian Wheezy dumps the binary in "usr/sbin/sshd" according to ps.
20:48 < _NSAKEY> killall -HUP sshd is a bit funny because it kills the ssh sessions.
20:48 < _NSAKEY> That's just a little too rude.
20:48 < v4mp> ;P
20:48 < v4mp> yea... so... along that line of reasoning
20:48 < v4mp> if your script restarts ssh
20:48 < v4mp> you're still closing connections potentially, albeit politely
20:48 < v4mp> so might just be better
20:48 < v4mp> to have the message at the end
20:49 < v4mp> that tells the user to restart manually
20:49 < v4mp> OR
20:49 < v4mp> have a message that asks y/n for autorestart
20:49 < _NSAKEY> But with restarting it, the current connections are still up.
20:49 < _NSAKEY> Using killall -HUP sshd, I get logged out.
20:50 < v4mp> ah, right
20:50 < v4mp> I suppose similar to network restart
20:50 < v4mp> where open connections are kept live
20:50 < v4mp> for ssh
20:54 < _NSAKEY> Oh, you have GOT to be shitting me.
20:54 < _NSAKEY> CentOS doesn't have "killall." It has "killall5."
20:54 <@oddball> ...why?!
20:55 < _NSAKEY> ... And it doesn't behave as anticipated.
20:55 <@oddball> That right there would cause me to avoid that OS
20:55 < _NSAKEY> oddball: I've got it installed in a VM for 100% academic reasons.
20:55 < _NSAKEY> aka, testing portability on this little github project.
20:56  * aestetix sighs
20:56 < aestetix> Anyone else had to deal with the process of someone who used to be a friend turning into a drone for their company?
20:56 < aestetix> And having an inability to think about anything unrelated to, not just engineering, but their specific engineering tasks from work?
21:03 < RangerZ> so Houston got Nashville 2010 levels of rain + results
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21:13 < _NSAKEY> v4mp: This is what the final product looks like: https://github.com/NSAKEY/happy-dance/blob/master/happy-dance.sh
21:13 < PigBot`> Title: happy-dance/happy-dance.sh at master · NSAKEY/happy-dance · GitHub (at github.com)
21:13 < _NSAKEY> RangerZ: I saw a weather map for the entire state before that rain started. Something like 95% of Texas was scheduled to get hard rain.
21:14 < RangerZ> yeah
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21:16 <@Dagmar> I'm sure Mirage is enjoying the street surfing
21:26 < RangerZ> problem is: they are still in TX
21:26 < RangerZ> because they believe the US Military is going to "invade" TX
21:26 < RangerZ> that Jade ....whatever...
21:29 < RangerZ> also, we already "covered" that in the 1860s....
21:49 < aestetix> wow
21:49 < aestetix> https://www.scribd.com/fullscreen/266348686?access_key=key-HO3WwL2p1HTck0xCjcMk&allow_share=true&escape=false&view_mode=scroll
21:49 < PigBot`> Title: Scribd (at www.scribd.com)
21:49 < RangerZ> yeah, old
21:49 < RangerZ> thats been known
21:50 < RangerZ> thats not really that unusual
21:50 < RangerZ> except for us "plebians"
21:50 < aestetix> ok
21:50 < aestetix> then give me $225,000 to speak at phreaknic for 30 minutes
21:51 < RangerZ> we did
21:51 < RangerZ> in doge coin
21:51 < RangerZ> ;)
21:52 < RangerZ> also, I said "normal" except for  US PLEBEIANS ;)
21:53 < RangerZ> lol
21:54 < _NSAKEY> I'd take $225,000 to tell bad jokes made up on the spot for a half hour.
21:58 < RangerZ> nah, she has her "pro big bankers" speech she gives where she tells them that 'the people' were too hard on the bankers after the economic crash
21:58 < RangerZ> and I _wish_ I was joking/being sarcastic
22:01 < aestetix> Here's how much that private jet is
22:01 < aestetix> http://www.celebrityjet.com/rates
22:01 < PigBot`> Title: RATES | Celebrity Jet Charter (at www.celebrityjet.com)
22:01 < aestetix> only $5000 an hour
22:01 < RangerZ> but 3day min.
22:01 < aestetix> 3 hour min
22:01 < RangerZ> hour?
22:02 < RangerZ> ohh nvm, yah
22:02 < RangerZ> but either way, private jets ARE NOT that expensive
22:02 < RangerZ> the most expensive part to ownership is fuel, and maint.
22:03 < aestetix> when you add up the other calculations
22:03 < aestetix> $225,000 does not seem that bad
22:05 < RangerZ> my grandfather used to own his own Cessna back in the day, and would fly fairly often for work b/c it made $ sense for him to own it to fly DeBartlo Sr. (his boss) to meetings in Chicago/NY, etc and be able to return the same/next day
22:06 < RangerZ> apparently the rental fee of the hangar was literally the most expensive part for him at the time
22:07 < RangerZ> then in the 70s the fuel became the 'hard' part
22:07 < RangerZ> (for 'some' reason) lol
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22:13 < RangerZ> but I've looked into ultra-lights/lights and for ~30k you can buy a 1~2 seater prop plane that gets basically the same MPG as a car, cruises at 88 MPH and uses ~4.5~5.5 Gallons/Hr , so ~17 MPG
22:16 < RangerZ> I was legit looking into it at one point, and wondering about the economics of it
22:17 < RangerZ> but unfortunately the utlra-light limit prevents you from getting any 'real' speed b/c of having to stay at really small engine/fuel load
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22:20 < RangerZ> 17 mpg and cruise speed of ~88 mph (a speed I've always found funny... b/c  almost every manf. hits that same exact speed as 'optimal cruise speed' lol) ... with 25 gallon tank... means max range of 440 miles or so... can't even reach NE Ohio in one go....  :/
22:20 < RangerZ> damn reality and its cold hard facts (let alone liberal bias), lol
22:32 < aestetix> http://www.buzzfeed.com/christophermassie/watch-this-rare-recently-surfaced-speech-old-obama-speech-fr?utm_term=.jtY58v6w8#.mhR0JX33
22:32 < PigBot`> Title: Watch This Rare, Recently Surfaced Obama Speech From 1995 - BuzzFeed News (at www.buzzfeed.com)
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23:09 < aestetix> ok dumb question
23:09 < aestetix> in python, what's the difference between initializing a variable with = {} versus = []
23:09 < aestetix> is that a dict vs a list or something?
23:17 < aestetix> nvevermind
23:25 < RangerZ> yep
--- Log closed Wed May 27 00:00:01 2015