--- Log opened Mon Nov 17 00:00:35 2014 00:07 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 00:07 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 00:10 -!- RangerZ1 [~rangerz@c-69-137-107-2.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #se2600 00:11 -!- RangerZ2 [~rangerz@c-69-137-107-2.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 00:11 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:41 < aestetix_> wilpig: found another pic of your gf, this one is nsfw: http://i.imgur.com/bN4if6l.jpg?1 00:45 < RangerZ> this is a quote that isn't, but should be... from taken 3 "Alright, let us negotiate. I will be as calm as possible in this situation." "Give us the leader right now and scatter away! If you do so, I will spare your lives!" 00:46 < RangerZ> "The negotiation... Has Failed? ... Just as I wanted!!" 00:58 < RangerZ> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZaDbUofNgE holy fuck... i was just kidding... 00:58 <@GateKeeper> Title: Taken 3 Official Trailer #1 (2015) - Liam Neeson, Maggie Grace Movie HD - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) 00:59 < RangerZ> so... watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZ02_Uzf7So first 00:59 <@GateKeeper> Title: Taken Trailer [HD] - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) 00:59 < RangerZ> then 3's trailer 01:01 < RangerZ> parallelism there is kinda epic 01:02 < RangerZ> shows me they realize what they are doing, and that its gotta a little out of hand/etc 01:07 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 01:07 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 01:12 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:49 <@northrup> Ugh... the Taken series 01:49 <@northrup> I foolishly saw the first one in the theater at the behest of a friend when it came out. 01:49 <@northrup> lesson learned, haven't seen another once... 01:50 <@northrup> s/once/one/ 02:07 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 02:07 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 02:10 < RangerZ> ehh, I enjoy them for what they are 02:11 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:13 < RangerZ> just picture a crowd of people you hate as the horde of badguys 02:13 < RangerZ> lol 02:14 -!- Peaches1984 [~terylbrak@c-69-137-93-158.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 02:18 -!- sasquatc4 [~sasquatc4@73.181.12.16] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:19 -!- sasquatc4 [~sasquatc4@73.181.12.16] has joined #se2600 02:23 < aestetix_> man 02:23 < aestetix_> I've been watching movies from the 80s 02:23 < aestetix_> America used to be awesome 02:23 < aestetix_> now it fucking sucks 02:26 <@Bahhumbug> Feel free to GTFO. 02:27 <@Bahhumbug> I've decided to name my new EL repo 'Psychotic Ninja' with a disttag of '.psychotic' 02:27 <@Bahhumbug> What could possibly go wrong? 02:38 < RangerZ> just don't name it "The One" 02:38 < RangerZ> aestetix_: movies in the 80s were just bigger lies 02:38 < RangerZ> plus we still had 'the foe' to fight 02:39 <@northrup> in mother russia, 80's movies make you 02:39 < RangerZ> and even in movies we could fight 'left over russian commies' until like 96 or s 02:39 < RangerZ> so* 02:41 < RangerZ> http://grist.org/climate-energy/4-reasons-republicans-are-losing-their-sht-over-the-u-s-china-climate-deal/ lol 02:41 <@GateKeeper> Title: 4 reasons Republicans are losing their sh*t over the U.S.-China climate deal | Grist (at grist.org) 02:42 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 02:42 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 02:42 < RangerZ> so net neutrality, immigration, the carbon goals with china... wtf... are we finally going to start getting that change? 02:42 < RangerZ> actually... obama's first 100 days, are going to be historic 02:42 < aestetix_> you know that the first thing republicans are going to do is about 500 attempts to repeal obamacare 02:43 < RangerZ> obama is going to eat one giant MFing poison pill, to get the budget passed for 2 years 02:43 < RangerZ> then we won't have a SINGLE fucking bill become a law until 2016 02:43 < RangerZ> lol 02:43 < aestetix_> I wonder how many vetoes we'll get 02:43 < RangerZ> depends on how far on impeachment he can taunt them 02:44 < aestetix_> consisting of 90% obamacare repeals, and 10% actual good bills that the GOP made shitty 02:44 < RangerZ> b/c its a no-lose situation 02:44 < RangerZ> if he is impeached by the house (not unlikely), the senate 'could' find him "guilty" 02:45 < RangerZ> and if so, it will only set a good precedent on limiting presidential powers 02:45 < aestetix_> doesn't it require 2/3 vote? 02:45 < RangerZ> and cause a backlash like no other 02:45 < RangerZ> 'could' 02:45 < RangerZ> but not likely 02:45 < RangerZ> house vote is 'somewhat likely' though I think 02:45 < RangerZ> but not senate 02:46 < aestetix_> Do they really want Uncle Joe to be president? 02:46 < RangerZ> and if he's found "not guilty", ohh could you imagine how pissed everyone would be 02:46 < RangerZ> they don't care 02:46 < RangerZ> he's white 02:46 < RangerZ> i mean... 02:46 < RangerZ> lol 02:46 < RangerZ> but seriously... most of them haven't thought that far ahead 02:46 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:46 <@northrup> I don't know if they're stuipd enough to run the impeachment route... that's a gamble that they canot afford to come off wrong before elections 02:46 <@northrup> a censure... maybe... 02:47 < RangerZ> northrup: Ted Cruz and the House Republicans... 02:47 < RangerZ> rush limbaugh 02:47 < RangerZ> etc. 02:47 <@Bahhumbug> They're already talking impeachment. 02:47 <@Bahhumbug> Again. 02:47 < aestetix_> There is this thing that you're supposed to learn when you're a kid: you can't always get what you want. 02:47 <@northrup> oh for fucks sake... what the hell... THAT is why I can never take them seriously... 02:47 <@Bahhumbug> RangerZ: Fuck Rush Dimbulb 02:47 < aestetix_> The GOP missed that day in school. 02:48 < RangerZ> Bahhumbug: i agree, and whats funny... apparently he's losing his channels and backing every week 02:48 < RangerZ> san fran just dropped him last week or so 02:48 <@Bahhumbug> That's been going on for 2 years now. 02:48 <@northrup> the moment that they HAVE some segment of power, they always want to use it to rehash the fucking past or rework some older legislation... never LEAD 02:48 < RangerZ> Bahhumbug: yeah, but its multiple a week now too 02:49 < RangerZ> northrup: the problem is that 1950s/1960s republicans don't exist 02:49 <@Bahhumbug> I wish he, and the entire Republicant Congress would contract a set of inoperable brain tumors. 02:49 <@northrup> ... it mkes me feel better imagining that they already have - and that's why they act the way they do 02:50 <@northrup> pressure on the reason and logic centers of the brain 02:50 <@Bahhumbug> Racism is now a tumor? 02:50 < RangerZ> if they did, I might be one, pass the civil rights act, found the EPA (1970s Nixon, but he was really a hold over of 60s, etc), end the vietnam war, clean water act,.... 02:50 < aestetix_> RangerZ: yes they do. We call them democrats 02:50 <@Bahhumbug> God I fucking hate agreeing with him... 02:51 < RangerZ> Bahhumbug: considering my mom had an inoperable brain tumor, and the only reason she's alive is b/c a doctor figured out a new surgery method... 02:51 < RangerZ> but yes 02:51 < RangerZ> i know.. 02:51 <@northrup> RangerZ: Wow! 02:51 <@Bahhumbug> The thing is... 02:51 <@Bahhumbug> I don't want your mom to die. 02:51 < aestetix_> I personally wish we'd put more money into HIV and cancer 02:51 <@Bahhumbug> The aforementioned Congress? Yes. Yes I do. 02:52 < aestetix_> But that's because I have family/friends afflicted 02:52 <@Bahhumbug> Everyone has friends / family afflicted. 02:52 < RangerZ> HIV funding is fine, we'll find a cure soon enough, as long as we don't lose more planes full of the leading reserachers :/ 02:52 < aestetix_> I wonder how things would be different if we reduced Congress's salary to be minimum wage 02:52 < aestetix_> haha 02:53 <@Bahhumbug> Why pay them in the first place? 02:53 < RangerZ> Bahhumbug: "to make them not corruptable by bribes" 02:53 < aestetix_> RangerZ: don't even get me started. HOPE had Ellsberg and Snowden keynoting together, and we lost publicity because of that fucking plane crash. 02:53 <@Bahhumbug> RangerZ: Uh-huh. 02:53 <@Bahhumbug> Your quotes need to be bigger. 02:53 <@northrup> I can't even get started down that path without needing a piece of leather to bite down on.. 02:53 < RangerZ> Bahhumbug: """""to make them not corruptable by bribes"""" 02:54 <@northrup> the founders never intended for ANYONE to be a 'career' politican that way we have today 02:54 < aestetix_> RangerZ: I don't think that plan is working. 02:54 * Bahhumbug & 02:54 <@northrup> serve your country, then move the fuck along back to your productive job in your respective community 02:54 < RangerZ> northrup: they also didn't think people (and I only mean white people of middle class+ economics) would live past 75 02:55 < RangerZ> b/c non-whites don't live past 65 :/ 02:55 < RangerZ> so social security being raised = you don't get to retire 02:55 < aestetix_> RangerZ: that wouldn't be a problem if there were any jobs for them 02:55 < RangerZ> yes it would be 02:55 < RangerZ> do you want your grandma working her entire life? 02:56 < aestetix_> I'd like her to have the option to work if she wants. 02:56 < RangerZ> mind you... my great grandfather worked until he was 76 or so... but he was an engineer and architect 02:56 < RangerZ> so he didn't have to lay bricks 02:56 < RangerZ> but most people aren't going to be that lucky 02:56 <@northrup> Right, the answer is NO... and then the next GOP phased thing is "Grandma should have saved and invested on her own".. 02:57 < RangerZ> I'm going to try and be a proffessor 02:57 < RangerZ> professor* 02:57 < aestetix_> northrup: that is funny. Because I have no savings at all. 02:57 < RangerZ> I don't mind never "retiring" 02:57 < aestetix_> Although that will change when I leave SF. 02:57 < RangerZ> we had a prof at my undergrad who was hired in 1968 02:57 < aestetix_> On the plus side I have no credit card debt. 02:58 <@northrup> sadly aestetix_ most people don't... they cannot afford to... 02:58 < RangerZ> he had students who went on to graduate... come back with phds... teach... and had already retired 02:58 <@northrup> yet some people think that it's just a matter of "saving more" 02:58 < aestetix_> northrup: saving money is great until you have a health issue 02:58 < RangerZ> thats ONLY an american issue 02:58 <@northrup> of the developed nations... yes 02:59 < aestetix_> In fact, that is precisely why I have no savings left. 02:59 <@northrup> which should be a crime 02:59 < RangerZ> and the cleveland clinic ended up writing off the _million dollar(s)_ worth of cost my mom's tumor took 02:59 < aestetix_> RangerZ: what's the point of developing all this amazing technology if nobody can afford it? 02:59 < RangerZ> b/c they used new techniques... gamma ray knife brain surgery 03:00 < aestetix_> Also, it seems like everyone is broke around the world these days. Where did the money go? 03:00 < RangerZ> you wouldn't like her when she's mad now... 03:00 <@northrup> RangerZ: Hahah!! 03:00 < aestetix_> Besides political campaigning 03:00 < RangerZ> the money has gone to the top 0.5% 03:00 < RangerZ> really simple 03:01 < aestetix_> Which would be great if it actually trickled down 03:01 < RangerZ> the robber barons of the 1850s never had as much money as the Walmart Walton Family has , as a % of ...any metric... 03:01 < RangerZ> % of GDP, % of median income, % of national wealth 03:01 < RangerZ> etc 03:01 < RangerZ> and one of them was from fucking youngstown 03:02 < aestetix_> Wasn't Rockefeller from Ohio? 03:02 < RangerZ> and he was "not rich" compared to koch brothers, etc 03:02 < RangerZ> almost everyone in history was from Ohio... then left 03:02 < RangerZ> lol 03:02 < aestetix_> Ok apparently he was from New York State. But he made his fortune in Ohio. 03:02 < RangerZ> like most of NASA... 03:03 < RangerZ> yeah 03:03 < RangerZ> Butler is who i'm refering to 03:03 < RangerZ> he was up there with Carneggie (sp?), Rockefeller, etc 03:04 < RangerZ> founded "The Butler Museum of American Art" because he wanted a painting and the owner would only sell it to a museum 03:04 < RangerZ> (first museum of american art, and still one of the largest collections) 03:04 < RangerZ> downtown Youngstown, lol 03:04 < aestetix_> Sam Butler? 03:05 < RangerZ> if you like NCAA basketball.... butler PA is named after him 03:05 < RangerZ> etc 03:05 < aestetix_> ok obviously not 03:05 < RangerZ> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_G._Butler,_Jr. 03:05 <@GateKeeper> Title: Joseph G. Butler, Jr. - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at en.wikipedia.org) 03:06 < RangerZ> but even the families like Butler/Rockefeller/etc 03:06 < RangerZ> gave MUCH more back as a % than we see now 03:06 < RangerZ> which is saddening 03:06 < aestetix_> well 03:07 < aestetix_> Ayn Rand hadn't written her stuff yet 03:07 < RangerZ> call out fucking 'conservatives' on that shit 03:07 < RangerZ> ask them how they like communist athiest ideology 03:07 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 03:07 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 03:07 < RangerZ> they stumble and shut up 03:08 < RangerZ> (the communist part is a trick question) 03:08 < RangerZ> but not the athiest 03:08 < aestetix_> actually they reply the way most atheists I know reply 03:08 < aestetix_> by getting pissy and either throwing a tantrum or leaving the room 03:09 < aestetix_> Then again, maybe Oakland is just bad 03:12 < RangerZ> i only talk with this room, and people with masters+ , so athiesm is quite common in those circles (thats not really a true statement, but you get my point) 03:12 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:16 < aestetix_> Fair enough. 03:16 < aestetix_> I'm stuck around a lot of folks who are vocal about what they don't believe in but quite uncertain what they do believe in (even if it's nothing) 03:17 < RangerZ> aestetix_: stop hanging out with millenials 03:18 < aestetix_> heh 03:18 < RangerZ> come to a nashville2600 meeting, nothing but old farts there 03:18 < aestetix_> Actually that's a large part of why I'm a hermit now. 03:18 < aestetix_> Most people around here are intolerable. 03:19 < RangerZ> whats funny is... I don't really go out down here... mainly b/c I have to drive everywhere 03:20 < RangerZ> i refuse to drink and drive, so I don't go drinking, and I've just started to hate driving 03:20 < aestetix_> I don't undersatnd drinking and driving 03:20 < RangerZ> b/c you live in oakland 03:20 < aestetix_> If you're drunk, why the fuck would you get in a car and drive 03:20 < aestetix_> heh 03:20 < RangerZ> if you lived in any city with as crap public transit as we have 03:20 < aestetix_> Well the idea of driving to a bar..... 03:20 < RangerZ> you'd understand 03:21 < RangerZ> a guy a know from MO was telling us how they would drink WHILE driving back home 03:21 < RangerZ> and no one cared 03:21 < RangerZ> b/c the worst you'd do is hit a cow fence 03:21 < RangerZ> out in BFE country-region 03:21 < RangerZ> then they would move to 'big cities' and get tickets all the time and be like WTF 03:26 < RangerZ> there are 3 groups of people who I see 'self-driving' cars being perfect for... city dwellers who want to time-share/rent cars and have them show up where/when they want them.... people who want to drive out to bars and drink.... etc.... and people like myself who hate the bothersome chore of driving 03:27 < RangerZ> but you have to consider that nashville ranks at or near #1 for average miles driven per day per citizen 03:27 < RangerZ> something like 26 03:28 <@Bahhumbug> Because your public transit system is an absolute joke. 03:28 < aestetix_> god 03:28 < aestetix_> that's awful 03:28 < aestetix_> and a waste of gas 03:29 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 03:29 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 03:29 < aestetix_> http://imgur.com/a/Bo0gy 03:31 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:32 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 03:32 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 03:32 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:32 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 03:32 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 03:32 < RangerZ> you think thats bad... imagine san fran with no rent rules, and no rent stabilization. etc 03:33 < RangerZ> so we have like ....4 new high rise condos going up right now 03:33 < RangerZ> they are changing the roads to fit around the new buildings, etc 03:33 < RangerZ> music row... the RCA recording hall was sold to a developer and they were going to tear it down to build a new condo suite 03:34 < RangerZ> but they faced a lot of possible political backlash b/c of famous people crying 03:34 < aestetix_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yt22XnfPjz0 03:34 < RangerZ> aestetix_: you need to give up reddit 03:34 < aestetix_> why? 03:34 < RangerZ> it might help your life dramatically 03:34 < RangerZ> you'd stop finding shit like that 03:36 < aestetix_> I thought the cheeseburger was amazing 03:37 <@northrup> RangerZ: amen to the bothersome chore of driving... if I could be doing something else productive durring that time ;) 03:37 < RangerZ1> i'd like to just sleep 03:37 <@northrup> I say 'productive' with a half ass smile... 03:37 < RangerZ1> or read a book 03:37 < RangerZ1> or ....play a video game... 03:37 < RangerZ1> lol 03:38 <@northrup> I'm the idiot that has completely fucked himself this week working on two projects that couldn't POSSIBLY have worse overlap... 03:38 < RangerZ1> did you at least give yourself flowers? 03:38 < RangerZ1> lol 03:39 <@northrup> time shifting to work with the UK at 3am central (9:00 GMT)... 03:40 < RangerZ1> http://www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-Shower-Speaker-Smartphones-Speakerphone/dp/B00KHX9MCW 03:40 < RangerZ1> anyone ever used a product like this? 03:40 < RangerZ1> I want to find some wireless speakers to listen to podcasts while I'm showering, etc 03:40 <@northrup> then working at 7:00 pm with the fine folks in Singapore (9:00 SGT) 03:41 < aestetix_> http://en.rocketnews24.com/2012/04/19/we-order-whopper-with-1050-bacon-strips-struggle-to-level-comically-huge-burger/ 03:41 <@northrup> no - but the speaker looks awesome 03:41 <@northrup> the price looks right 03:42 < RangerZ1> compared to the multi-hundred dollar solutions everyone else wants to put out 03:42 < RangerZ1> which makes me say 'hahaha...no' 03:43 < RangerZ1> I might just pick them up... if I do... I'll let ya'll know how they are 03:43 <@northrup> the reviews seem to look good too 03:43 < RangerZ1> yeah 03:43 < RangerZ1> thats what made me think about it... 03:44 < RangerZ1> http://www.amazon.com/SoundBot%C2%AE-SB510-Resistant-Bluetooth-Speakerphone/dp/B00IGUUYTI/ 03:44 < RangerZ1> 14$ 03:44 < RangerZ1> and 'meh' reviews 03:44 < RangerZ1> 3.5 03:51 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:31 <@Dolemite_> mr0ning, be0tches and h0ez! 07:31 -!- Dolemite_ is now known as Dolemite 07:37 -!- notfie [~fie@ip68-111-116-14.fv.ks.cox.net] has joined #se2600 07:56 -!- RangerZ2 [~rangerz@c-69-137-107-2.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #se2600 07:56 -!- RangerZ1 [~rangerz@c-69-137-107-2.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:59 <@wilpig> RangerZ: why would anyone want a speakerphone in the shower? the bluetooth speaker I understand and fully support 08:01 <@Dolemite> Yeah, I really don't want to hear what wilpig's doing in the shower 08:01 <@wilpig> wow. west kentucky got 2" of snow last night 08:02 <@wilpig> Dolemite: generally? listening to music and groaning about being old 08:07 -!- RangerZ1 [~rangerz@c-69-137-107-2.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #se2600 08:09 -!- RangerZ2 [~rangerz@c-69-137-107-2.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:12 <@wilpig> looks like we're going on generator power wednesday morning so they can work on the transformer for our room 08:26 -!- PeteDaGuru [~PeteDaGur@user-0c99bgh.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #se2600 09:25 <@Dickie> ROBOTS IN DISGUISE 09:31 -!- K4k [~K4k@unaffiliated/k4k] has joined #se2600 09:44 -!- spaceB0x [~spaceB0x@162.218.105.210] has joined #se2600 09:47 <@benthemeek> So we had a productive officers meetings yesterday 09:48 <@benthemeek> meeting* 09:48 <@Bahhumbug> Dru resigned and Crazy Bitch is in the wind? 09:49 <@benthemeek> We talked a lot about this may day event Dru would like to do, and we all agreed that to even be considered a posibility a certain number of sponsors would have to be found and in place first. 09:51 <@benthemeek> Dru wants to run again, and actually I am all for it. I will be making sure the slack gets picked up from the communication side 09:51 <@benthemeek> We need a vice president though, maybe oddball or one of the others would sign on? 09:52 <@Dolemite> Hahahahahaahaha 09:52 <@benthemeek> It would be helpful to have someone that hangs out in here in the loop and making sure we get the emails and announcments communicated effectively 09:52 <@Bahhumbug> If I buy you a set of balls would it help? 09:53 <@benthemeek> I am not going to run against Dru, he has a vision of the con and I think we can do it. 09:53 <@Bahhumbug> Stop thinking. Act. 09:53 <@Bahhumbug> fuck it. Waste of my time. 09:57 <@wilpig> benthemeek: he can have all teh vision he wants but without the skillset to accomplish it the best you can hope for it a promising vision. step up, be a leader, make his vision happen. You have the skillset to manage it. Step up and make a difference. You've already been told what is gonna happen if dru is re-elected 09:58 <@benthemeek> wilpig: As has he. 09:59 <@benthemeek> I don't think everyone here is being fair to him (in my judgement) He worked his tail off the second half of last year. And amber is out of the picture 09:59 <@wilpig> the difference being, you want to see it go on and get bigger, where he wants to see it go on and get bigger with his glorious self as the reason 09:59 <@benthemeek> No I don't think so 09:59 <@benthemeek> This is not his ego on the line 09:59 <@wilpig> sure it is 09:59 <@wilpig> simple question, can I email the phreaknic list? 10:00 <@benthemeek> He is very serious about getting everything straightened up 10:00 <@Mirage_> The last 2-3 months before the con is when everything that's been planned falls into place, not when you finally decide to start planning instead of just talking 10:00 <@benthemeek> I don't know. He may still have you moderated 10:00 <@benthemeek> When you call someone shit for brains on a list where people are getting on to talk about the con that may be why ;) 10:01 <@wilpig> until the point at which he acts like I want to help and retracts his head from his ass, he is acting for his own benefit 10:01 <@Mirage_> I'm pretty sure that we always made sure we at least had the artwork by august so we could get the orders for t-shirts, etc in early 10:01 <@benthemeek> You think the artwork came to late? My biggest problem was the website 10:02 <@Mirage_> Dolemite was normally looking forward to the con so that he could get all the boxes of swag, etc out of his house. 10:02 <@Mirage_> the artwork is one of the lesser things to worry about. 10:02 <@Mirage_> and yes, there is/was no excuse for the website... 10:03 <@wilpig> benthemeek: your biggest problem should be that a good portion of the community was alienated by the lack of communication and outright unprofessional behavior 10:03 <@benthemeek> Okay, lets shift the blame a bit. Last year was mostly MY fault. I could have made a website, I could have been overly communicative. I sat back and left that to others 10:03 <@benthemeek> Watch how I step up this year 10:03 <@Mirage_> That shit should have been up back in jan/feb at least as a "work in progress, information coming" page awaiting the date, artwork, theme, etc 10:04 <@wilpig> benthemeek: run for president, or shut up 10:04 <@benthemeek> wilpig: The unprofessional behaviour by Amber correct? 10:04 <@Bahhumbug> wilpig: +1 10:04 <@Bahhumbug> I will happily buy you a set of testicles. 10:04 <@Bahhumbug> Run for President. 10:05 <@Bahhumbug> If Dru wants to work on a good con, let him. 10:05 <@Bahhumbug> He doesn't need to wear an officer's hat to do that. 10:05 <@wilpig> you can let him work on the con, he just won't be calling the shots 10:05 <@Bahhumbug> FUCK ME 10:05 <@Bahhumbug> It's snowing here :/ 10:05 <@benthemeek> Bahhumbug: I am not familure with your contributions to the con. Perhaps we have met I am unsure. 10:05 <@Bahhumbug> Nope. 10:05 * wilpig puts on a hazmat suit 10:05 * wilpig rubs against Bahhumbug 10:05 <@Bahhumbug> There is one person from around here that knows me personally. 10:05 <@Bahhumbug> And they are never around :( 10:06 <@Bahhumbug> But I can speak from an outsiders perspective seeing how this trainwreck played out and being on both sides of this nonsense in the past. 10:06 <@Bahhumbug> Dru's not officer material. Period. 10:06 <@Bahhumbug> You can defend his shit all you want. 10:07 <@Bahhumbug> But the fact remains that 1) he can't delegate 2) he has paranoia issues 3) his judgement of character is flawed (ref: Amber). 10:07 <@Bahhumbug> These alone paint all the reasons necessary for him not to be an officer. 10:07 <@wilpig> we all gave crazypants a chance, in his defence 10:08 <@Bahhumbug> The logs of this channel are all the evidence necessary for anyone to see she's a crazy bitch. 10:08 <@benthemeek> I made him very aware of the comments she has said on twitter as well 10:08 <@benthemeek> about him. 10:08 <@benthemeek> He had no idea. 10:09 <@Bahhumbug> Head. Ass. 10:09 <@Bahhumbug> The former doesn't belong in the latter. 10:10 <@benthemeek> I don't think he spends time online much. Not saying that is an excuse, but just that he didn't quite understand what he was dealing with 10:10 -!- klixa [~klixa@unaffiliated/klixa] has joined #se2600 10:10 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o klixa] by ChanServ 10:10 <@Bahhumbug> Yeah, because _no one_ warned him. 10:11 <@Bahhumbug> Did I forget the tag? 10:11 <@benthemeek> In any case, this years con WAS good. Largely due to Dru. It was always my stance that we were going to wait and see how the con went to judge him. I think its worth continuing with this set of people in charge and we just need to fix the poor communication 10:11 <@wilpig> He doesn't understand anything that he doesn't want to know about. You're at least taking in the periphreal aspects of planning. 10:12 <@wilpig> Do you agree that in order to be successful and not just mediocre you need to have a full understanding of everything going on? 10:12 <@klixa> why are you people still talkign abotu this, dru is a douche, and the majority of people agree and a few dissenters (like benthemeek ) dont agree :P 10:12 <@Bahhumbug> And just forget the threats of legal action, the slander and innuendo, the lies and all the other bullshit? 10:12 <@Bahhumbug> Gotcha. 10:12 <@wilpig> Depending on a sponsor = not successful 10:12 <@benthemeek> He got the speakers, he arranged for the extra activities. The website and communication isnt his strong suite, but I'm secretary. I can fix that 10:13 <@wilpig> sponsor has always been for extra shit. water bottle, pig roast, pizza party, etc 10:13 <@wilpig> It was his job to organize that stuff not to do it 10:13 <@wilpig> he failed at his job 10:13 <@Bahhumbug> You are powerless, sorry. Either run for pres or don't, but don't think you have the power to influence anything. 10:13 <@wilpig> if you are going to organize it then you are the one in charge and should be the president 10:13 * oddball pokes his head in 10:13 * oddball reads scroll back 10:14 <@oddball> nope 10:14 <@wilpig> oddball: repeat after me. "ben, run for president or shut up" 10:14 <@klixa> seriously, do you relaise how much time ALL of you waist bitching about this? 10:14 <@Bahhumbug> My waist is big but not that big. 10:14 <@oddball> wilpig: Oh, I've been pushing for ben for prez for a while. 10:14 <@benthemeek> klixa: We are still talking about it because I had a good post con meeting with Dru and Tilghman yesterday 10:14 <@Dickie> Burn it down 10:14 <@Bahhumbug> He doesn't have the balls. 10:14 <@wilpig> I'd prefer to waste time working on websites and stupid shit for a con. but with the current bafoon that isn't possible 10:15 <@klixa> " a good post con meeting" huh benthemeek , i dont understand what you just said, feel like a word might have been left out 10:16 <@Bahhumbug> pretend there is a hyphen between post and con. 10:16 <@oddball> benthemeek: I have a very hard time not thinking that he said what he thought you needed to hear, not what he plans on doing. 10:16 <@benthemeek> wilpig: My point is this. In the past we let one or two people just do everything and coast (you did it all for 16, 17) Dru has the ability to get speakers and get people from other groups to come in. We can let him do that. Someone else can take care of the stuff he doesnt 10:17 <@Bahhumbug> He Does Not Need To Wear An Officer's Hat To Do That 10:17 <@benthemeek> oddball: run for vice president and help me fix this 10:17 <@Bahhumbug> I don't think you understand quite how fractured the community is over all this. 10:17 <@wilpig> benthemeek: he isn't a president getting speakers and getting people to come in. he's a spokesman 10:17 <@wilpig> the president's job is to organize 10:17 <@wilpig> ORGANIZE 10:18 <@wilpig> not just take notes then later forget about them 10:18 <@oddball> benthemeek: And have the folks under the president try to tell the president what to do? 10:18 <@benthemeek> :) Well I have given my opinion and I will be voting for him in December and I will be picking up the communication slack 10:18 <@benthemeek> oddball: Dru is not a dictator he does a lot on concensus 10:19 <@Bahhumbug> Organize and delegate. 10:19 <@Bahhumbug> Not necessarily in that order. 10:20 <@klixa> benthemeek: well evil peopel are attracted to evil people :| 10:20 <@benthemeek> wilpig: I dont care about titles. I will do what you did if I have to and not hold any position at all and still work on stuff. It doesnt matter. Dru is being effective at getting people to the con and that is all that is important to me. Others can pick up slack 10:20 <@wilpig> he works on concensus of those that agree with him 10:20 <@klixa> turning everyone against you is not effective 10:21 <@wilpig> with dru as president you are doing it alone. you're saying you don't want my help, or dolemite, oddball, dagmar, rangerz, etc 10:21 <@Bahhumbug> And I wonder how many people would have been there had he NOT been running the thing. 10:21 <@Bahhumbug> I suspect more than showed up. 10:21 <@benthemeek> klixa: I agree he is a bit paranoid but look who was whispering in his ear 10:21 <@wilpig> himself? 10:21 <@Bahhumbug> That's no fucking excuse. 10:21 <@Bahhumbug> None at all. 10:22 <@Bahhumbug> He _let her_. 10:22 <@klixa> i have met him, and i feel yoru view of him is delusioanl and everyone else's is right benthemeek 10:22 <@benthemeek> If the only messages he got were nagative ones about this channel and threats on the mailing list he is oging to be paranoid 10:22 <@Bahhumbug> Bullshit. 10:22 <@klixa> we just cant understand why you cant see it or refuse to see it benthemeek 10:22 <@Bahhumbug> The logs are available to anyone that wanted them. 10:22 <@Bahhumbug> He could have mined them and seen for himself. 10:22 <@Bahhumbug> He didn't. 10:22 <@Bahhumbug> So, again, bullshit. 10:22 <@wilpig> benthemeek: forget everything else. lets go back to last spring and what was said about the help@ or the general nahsville2600 adresses? 10:22 <@klixa> you are elvating someone wiht maybe 10% good and 90% bad and demonisonzing the people with 90% good and 10% bad benthemeek 10:23 <@wilpig> what was said about me, specifically, in that regard 10:23 <@klixa> "he can get speakers" well YAY that fixes EVERYTHINIG, and ALL his other issues 10:23 <@wilpig> you want to talk about hearing negative shit. you have someone making negative shit up! he never contacted me or attempted to 10:23 <@wilpig> he needed a bad guy to make himself look like the victim so that way he could garner support instead of just stepping up and leading to gain support 10:24 <@wilpig> is that the kind of leadership you want? didn't attempt so just made up an excuse? 10:24 <@benthemeek> wilpig: No 10:24 <@wilpig> wrong 10:24 <@Bahhumbug> Bullshit. You just said you were going to vote for him. 10:24 <@Bahhumbug> So please, grow a spine. 10:24 <@wilpig> bevause you are voting for him again despite that! 10:26 <@Bahhumbug> Crickets 10:26 <@benthemeek> You think my choice to vote for him is because I lack the courage to confront him on the things he fails at. I have talked to him. Its not a lack of balls as to why I support him 10:26 <@Bahhumbug> Yes it is. You don't want to alienate him. 10:26 <@klixa> i think you are secretly in love with him, thats the only thing that makes sense to me benthemeek 10:27 <@Bahhumbug> You don't like confrontation. 10:27 <@wilpig> if you managed to get dru to admit in public that he made all that shit up, then he would be showing a sign that he wants to change and is growing the fuck up. but that will NEVER happen 10:27 <@benthemeek> Bahhumbug: Too true (about disliking confrontation) But yet here I am back on this channel trying to make a case for him :) 10:27 <@Bahhumbug> That's not confrontation. 10:27 <@Dolemite> I am completely unapologetic when someone answer their cell phone in the bathroom right before I let out a giant fart. Always be mindful of your surroundings, I say. 10:27 <@Bahhumbug> If you run against him _that's_ confrontation. 10:28 <@oddball> benthemeek: For the record, I think you're willing to vote for him again because you think he'll change. I disagree. 10:28 <@wilpig> voting for him just sends the message that you agree with how he did things and you want to see it continue 10:28 <@benthemeek> I don't plan on him changing oddball, I plan on stepping up to make sure the website and the lists are communicated with myself 10:29 <@oddball> Dolemite: Apparently I'm the wierdo because I refuse to answer a phone call while on the can. 10:29 <@Bahhumbug> oddball: +1 10:29 <@wilpig> oddball: chicken 10:29 <@Bahhumbug> haha 10:29 <@wilpig> I love answering the phone when in the bathroom 10:29 <@oddball> benthemeek: So... you plan on doing the job of the president for him. 10:29 <@Dolemite> oddball: Well (a) yes, you're always lumped into any category containing the word 'weirdo' and (b) you're not alone 10:29 <@benthemeek> Heard a story of the radio this morning that some dude at a preds game last week was drunk and face timing while standing at the wall of uninals 10:30 <@wilpig> that's the kind of person you drop his phone into the urinal for him 10:30 <@wilpig> because he's a blight on society 10:30 <@wilpig> and not just because he's using an iphone 10:30 <@oddball> Oh, and I think illegal, since e was operating a video camera in the bathroom. 10:31 <@benthemeek> oddball: I think its a mistake to expect the president to do everything. I think he needs a support team. I really don't care who gets credit for what I am going to see phreaknic grow if it kills me.. 10:31 <@benthemeek> well maybe not if it kills me, but I am going to do all I can to help. And I dont think kicking him out is the way to do it effectivly 10:31 <@Bahhumbug> It's a helluva start. 10:31 <@Bahhumbug> 09:12:36] <@Bahhumbug> And just forget the threats of legal action, the slander and innuendo, the lies and all the other bullshit? 10:32 <@oddball> I agree. His job is to deligate and make sure that those that are supposed to get shit done are getting shit done. In that, he was a complete failure this past year. 10:32 <@oddball> Oh... and good relations with the membership and general public. Another failure. 10:32 <@wilpig> benthemeek: you aren't kicking him out of the organizaion. you're moving him to a role that is better suited him 10:33 <@benthemeek> I asked him yesterday about this 10:33 <@Bahhumbug> And he told you what you wanted to hear? 10:33 <@benthemeek> What if I ran for president, and you ran for vice we could still bring in the circuit benders ball and these other people you have lined up. 10:33 <@klixa> you have NO business being president, refer to Bahhumbug 's spine comment 10:34 <@Bahhumbug> That's not wholely true. 10:34 <@klixa> you'd try to please everyone, and there would be chaos 10:34 <@Bahhumbug> I suspect Ben can delegate. 10:34 <@benthemeek> kilxa: I have plenty of spine or I wouldnt be arguing his case 10:34 <@Bahhumbug> And by proper delegation you remove yourself from that morass as a whole. 10:35 <@oddball> benthemeek: And if he said anything other than "of course," he's being a petty little shit. 10:36 <@wilpig> ^ 10:36 <@benthemeek> I explained about how this part of the community sees him. Mostly I THINK because of amber 10:36 <@benthemeek> Now I no he got in a pissing match with you Wilpig and I am not discounting that 10:36 <@wilpig> oddball: anything other than that shows that he will only participate if he's the one in charge. 10:37 <@benthemeek> know* 10:37 <@oddball> So... what was his answer? 10:38 <@benthemeek> He said he really wants to fix things with the by-laws and the organization and build it to a level more like derbycon or libertycon 10:38 <@oddball> for fucks sake 10:38 <@benthemeek> That he can do it more effectively as beign president 10:38 <@wilpig> benthemeek: he can't do that 10:38 <@wilpig> he doesn't have the skills 10:39 <@wilpig> he can't organize therefore he cannot build up 10:39 <@klixa> benthemeek: of course he claims he can do it more effectively as president, hes trying to persuade you to vote for him 10:39 <@oddball> So... he refused to answer your question. 10:39 <@wilpig> oddball: +1 10:39 <@benthemeek> No he did 10:39 <@benthemeek> He said that he tried that the year before 10:40 <@wilpig> proof 10:40 <@benthemeek> where he was vice for 17 10:40 <@wilpig> where is the proof 10:40 <@benthemeek> I told him what you would say wilbur 10:40 <@wilpig> this is "I emailed wilbur but he wouldn't answer" 10:40 <@oddball> And didn't lift a finger? 10:40 <@benthemeek> I said but that year werent you out of pocket a lot because of health issues etc. 10:40 <@Dolemite> You know how Derbycon got to be the size that it is today? 1. It figured out its identity from the beginning. 2. It embraced the community that it was catering to. 3. The leadership communicated early and often to that community, and engaged heavily in forums and social media. 10:40 <@benthemeek> he said he missed 2 meetings 10:40 <@Dolemite> PhreakNIC hasn't even figured out #1 on that list 10:41 <@wilpig> Dolemite: +1 10:41 <@benthemeek> Dolemite: I like the purpose you made 10:41 <@benthemeek> to educate the community etc 10:41 <@oddball> benthemeek: He also failed to show up for setup at the con, and spent the entire tear down scribbling in his notebook and talking to people about how much of a failure that con was. 10:41 <@benthemeek> Seems clear enough to me 10:42 <@Bahhumbug> How about we just stop all this. benthemeek's mind is quite obviously made up. He's not going to do anything to change the situation. 10:43 <@Bahhumbug> He continues to make excuses. 10:43 * benthemeek nods 10:43 <@benthemeek> I am not making excuses 10:43 <@klixa> Bahhumbug: yes 10:43 <@benthemeek> I will give you no excuses this year 10:43 <@klixa> benthemeek: yeah you are 10:43 <@klixa> wilpig: you lose, cause you arent there in person to sway him like dru 10:43 <@klixa> sorry 10:43 <@benthemeek> if something doenst go right its because of me. I dont care who the president is 10:43 <@Bahhumbug> he continues to overlook the rampant amount of bullshit that has come _DIRECTLY_ from Dru. 10:44 <@Bahhumbug> This is 'sposed to be a hacker community. And the _president_ of the organization threatened another member with legal action. 10:44 <@Bahhumbug> That alone should be all that's needed to get the fucker out of office. 10:44 <@benthemeek> Bahhumbug: I see that Dru can do things that I can't as president. I need him. I can pick up the rest of the slack 10:44 <@Bahhumbug> Excuses. 10:44 <@Bahhumbug> You can justify it any way you want that makes you able to sleep better at night. 10:44 <@benthemeek> No, strategy 10:45 * Dickie throws a chair 10:45 <@Bahhumbug> No, it's actually the opposite of strategy. 10:45 <@Bahhumbug> Strategy would be to run, get elected, and delegate out the parts you aren't able to do or aren't comfortable doing it. 10:45 <@benthemeek> I dont need a freaking title. I need an evangelist who goes to different cons like the 5 that dru goes to and gets speakers and makes phreaknic interesting 10:45 <@benthemeek> You know we had like 20 people show up just to hear les johnson talk? 10:46 <@Bahhumbug> Wow. 20. 10:46 <@benthemeek> 20 NEW people 10:46 <@benthemeek> word will spread 10:46 <@klixa> no it wont 10:46 <@benthemeek> And Keith's setup? That was Dru. All of bsides Atlanta knows about phreaknic because of Dru 10:47 <@Dolemite> benthemeek: But you had 50 people not show up because they saw PhreakNIC in the death throes of disorganization and piss poor communications. 10:47 <@benthemeek> That is what I need. The organizing website stuff someone else can do if needed 10:47 <@benthemeek> Dolemite: I dont doubt it 10:48 <@benthemeek> But If I step and fix that, all I have to do if keep dru from shooting himself in the foot 10:48 <@klixa> you cant fix it 10:48 <@Dolemite> The problem is that you won't get the support from people who feel like Dru nuked the bridges from orbit 10:48 <@wilpig> you can't keep him from shooting himself in the foot 10:48 <@wilpig> what thing can dru do as president that you can't? 10:48 <@wilpig> get people in? that isn't the job of hte president 10:49 <@Dolemite> While it's true that you haven't severed relationships, with Dru in the drivers seat nobody will see you at all. 10:49 <@benthemeek> wilpig: If being president is what it takes to get the people that we did last year, give it away. It doesnt matter who holds that position as you well proved. It matters that the stuff gets done 10:50 <@benthemeek> If I have to wait a few years until Dru's time has run its course to get you all back (hoepfully) then so be it 10:50 <@Bahhumbug> ... 10:50 <@Bahhumbug> Wow 10:50 <@Dolemite> There won't be anything to get us to come back to 10:51 <@wilpig> what does being president have to do with getting people in ? NOTHING that's about ego. and the fact that you just told all of us to fuck off... wow 10:51 <@wilpig> just wow 10:51 <@benthemeek> You are makign the con about one man 10:51 <@benthemeek> and in fact he is just a minor player 10:51 <@Dolemite> Dru has always made PhreakNIC about him 10:51 <@klixa> i have youtube videos that disprove you benthemeek 10:51 <@klixa> dru acts liek its ALL him 10:51 <@klixa> ON VIDEO 10:51 <@klixa> there is evidence 10:51 <@Bahhumbug> I've even watched one of those. 10:51 <@Dolemite> Even when he had nothing to do with it, he would show up and claim that he still had some hand in it 10:51 <@benthemeek> His interview at phreaknic 17 10:52 <@Bahhumbug> Egotistical doesn't even come close. 10:52 <@klixa> phreaknic is ALL about him in his mind..hell its called phreaknic and hes form atalanta wher ethey have freaknic 10:52 <@klixa> ALL ABOUT HIM 10:52 <@benthemeek> This isn't about who gets credit. I dont care if he claims he did it all himself. I like phreaknic. I wont let it die 10:52 <@Dolemite> benthemeek: It's already dead. You just don't realize it, yet. 10:53 <@wilpig> you aren't letting it die. you're actively killing it by putting him in charge 10:53 <@benthemeek> Dolemite: I will take that as a challenge to prove you wrong. 10:53 <@klixa> you are fighting against the wrong people 10:53 <@benthemeek> wilpig: it doesnt matter whos in charge it matters that the work gets done, correct? 10:53 <@klixa> not true 10:53 <@Bahhumbug> If I am ever this spineless I would be happy if one of you would just shoot me in the back of the head. 10:54 <@wilpig> if the person in charge is alienating the community, then it matters 10:54 <@klixa> when you hav bad people in charge that wont answer anyone's emails for months and font take it seriously until the last minute, it bothers peopel benthemeek 10:54 <@wilpig> if the person in charge isn't doing his job and just hanging out, fine as long as it gets done 10:54 <@Dolemite> benthemeek: If that were true, Skydog would still be running PhreakNIC 10:54 <@Bahhumbug> benthemeek: I've said this before and I will say it again. I actually like you. I am just very disgusted that you won't man up and take it over. 10:54 <@benthemeek> I am not fighting against anyone, least of all you. I am simply trying to persuade you that equating phreaknic with Dru is not correct. 10:54 <@klixa> when you have someone that is playing passive aggressive BS games with the rest of teh community, it matters 10:55 <@wilpig> benthemeek: to the outside world phreaknic != dru in dru's head dru === phreaknic 10:55 <@Bahhumbug> benthemeek: Dude. It's all about him. I've never been there, I am an outsider, and I CAN SEE THIS. 10:55 <@klixa> wilpig: i thought phreaknic was all dru based on youtube videos when i hadnt heard much about it form people in here 10:55 <@klixa> so, he does present that view to the outside world 10:56 <@benthemeek> Well... You might be right. But I am going to give him another year and do what I said. Thats my choice. I am just going to make sure no more bridges are burned if I can help it 10:56 <@Bahhumbug> You can't. 10:56 <@Dolemite> And at the risk of sounding like an egomaniac, if the person in charge doesn't matter, then why did the convention grow so much when I was leading the team? It's not because I did it all, it's because I was an effective leader of others who got things done and I held themn accountable when they didn't, rather than simply coming up with excuses for why it didn't happen. 10:56 <@klixa> benthemeek: people like you are why the holocaust happened 10:56 <@wilpig> there are countless stories of him showing up to phreaknics past trying to get free entry, etc. it is all about him and if he isn't in charge then he's refusing to help? that isn't about the con that's about him 10:57 <@Bahhumbug> And there's Godwin. 10:57 <@Dickie> Aaaaand klixa with the Godwin 10:57 <@Dickie> Nice 10:57 <@klixa> godwin? 10:57 <@benthemeek> Dolemite: I hate the excuses too. I confronted him yesterday about them, and told him we only had ourselves to blame. If I have to be the leader from the shadows I will. I really dont care 10:57 <@wilpig> you cannot lead from the shadows when he's teh spotlight 10:58 <@Bahhumbug> @define Godwin's Law 10:58 <@GateKeeper> Bahhumbug: Law - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary: ; Law | Define Law at Dictionary.com - Reference.com: ; Law - definition of Law by The Free Dictionary: ; Law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: ; law: (2 more messages) 10:58 <@benthemeek> You did Wilbut 10:58 <@Bahhumbug> @define Godwin 10:58 <@GateKeeper> Bahhumbug: Urban Dictionary: Godwins Law: ; Urban Dictionary: godwin: ; Godwins law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: ; Godwin - definition of Godwin by The Free Dictionary: ; Godwin - Definition and (2 more messages) 10:58 <@benthemeek> Tell me you didnt run everything at 16, 17 10:58 <@wilpig> when I was directing shit, notlarry was in charge 10:58 <@Dolemite> benthemeek: It is absolutely posible to "lead from behind" but only when you're not having to counteract negative actions from the leadership position. 10:58 <@wilpig> people listened to me and got things done because I had a plan and tried to keep people to it 10:58 <@Bahhumbug> You mean you managed? 10:58 <@wilpig> when the shit didn't get done, rather than hold people to the fire I did it myself 10:58 <@Dolemite> Leading from behind means that you are leading by example, and doing things that you ask others to do, rather than sitting on high and sending out edicts 10:58 <@Bahhumbug> Imaginey that. 10:58 <@wilpig> that is horrible leadership 10:58 <@klixa> Dickie and Bahhumbug :( damnit, im an internet cliche 10:59 <@klixa> well, i cant say what i am really thinking, the nazi comment was nicer than what was in my head 10:59 <@Dickie> Let it out. This place is a cesspool. 10:59 <@benthemeek> lol 10:59 * Dickie farts 10:59 <@Bahhumbug> You're not Amber. It can't be that bad. 10:59 * wilpig hands Dickie a cork 10:59 <@klixa> lol 11:00 <@klixa> benthemeek's niceness and tolerance of dru just irks me is all 11:00 <@klixa> dru is bad, why cant he see it!!!!!!!! 11:00 <@benthemeek> Everyone I have met in person in this room at least I believe is reasonable and not total trolls :) 11:00 <@Bahhumbug> Bromance? 11:00 <@Dickie> let's talk about him like he's not here 11:00 <@Dickie> That's not passive-aggression 11:00 <@klixa> Bahhumbug: its the only logical conlusion 11:00 <@benthemeek> If dru is bad, he beleives hes good 11:01 <@benthemeek> He tells himself the story he is good 11:01 <@Dickie> LIKE HITLER 11:01 * Dickie foams at the mouth 11:01 <@klixa> benthemeek: yeah, well...i think most people think they are good 11:01 <@benthemeek> and he convinces others that its a true story 11:01 <@klixa> those ISIS people lopping off heads think they are good 11:01 <@klixa> that means nothing 11:01 <@wilpig> you just described the entire problem. you admitted the problem by saying he tells himself a story and then believes it. 11:01 <@klixa> wilpig: thats benthemeek 's worldview in general 11:01 <@klixa> we all tell outselves stories 11:01 <@Dickie> Is there a Godwin for terrorism now? 11:01 <@Dickie> Sheesh. 11:01 <@klixa> lol 11:02 <@benthemeek> klixa: I know it means nothing. But we are all telling ourselves a story about ourselves. :P 11:02 <@Dickie> Did you vote for Bush? 11:02 <@klixa> benthemeek: well, dru's story is wrong 11:02 <@klixa> benthemeek: i just cant understand why you support someone that the majoroty of the group is against. 11:02 <@benthemeek> dolemite: said something at some point in the past: There is his story, there is thier side of the story and there is the truth 11:03 <@Bahhumbug> wtf? You just acknowledged a core part of the problem and you're still fucking defending him? 11:03 <@klixa> dru is a great talker...he's good at manipulating peopel 11:04 <@klixa> i used to listen to him on 91 when i was 14, and he made it seem like he practically invented those whistles that let you make free phone calls 11:04 <@klixa> he is delusional and full of himself 11:04 <@oddball> Hell, he even admits it. He proudly states that his strength is "social engineering." 11:04 <@Bahhumbug> I have this strange feeling from watching the video of Dru's interview that he has done some reading on NLP. 11:04 <@Bahhumbug> Because he talks like it. He writes like it. And he gets lots of sheep following him. 11:04 <@klixa> well, 20 years ago he was great at manipulaitng people im sure hes only gotten better 11:04 <@benthemeek> Dickie: I used to be a right wing evangelical conservative, of course I voted for Bush 11:05 <@benthemeek> That was before I woke up or found this community 11:05 <@klixa> NO benthemeek 11:05 <@Dickie> Was asking klixa in the context of her comparisons 11:05 <@klixa> dont act liek this group is the opposite of that, and make it out to be a group of insane anythign goes liberals 11:05 <@Dickie> So...yes? 11:05 <@Dolemite> What interview are you talking about? 11:06 <@Dolemite> Is this something that will make me want to punch a baby if I watch it? 11:06 <@benthemeek> klixa: I didn't say this group is the opposite of that. This group calls bullshit where they see it and thinks outside the box for th emost part 11:06 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 11:06 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 11:06 <@benthemeek> they wouldnt get along with my conservative or my liberal friends politcally 11:07 <@Bahhumbug> Dolemite: I think it was the tail end of last year's convention where he was sitting down being interviewed by someone. 11:07 <@Bahhumbug> Let me go see if I have it b'marked. 11:07 <@benthemeek> Dolemite: At phreaknic 17 some podcast guy showed up and wanted to talk to someone about the creation oh phreaknic. Dru was okay to be interviewed 11:07 <@klixa> benthemeek: you still think like a christian 11:07 <@klixa> :P 11:08 <@klixa> Dickie: asking me what abut what? 11:08 <@benthemeek> I think that order is hard to find and maintain, and that some authority has it's uses 11:08 <@klixa> im chasing a 1 year old while talking, so sometimes i get lost 11:08 <@Dickie> Forget it. We're off the rails. 11:08 * klixa insults benthemeek some more 11:08 <@klixa> we're still doing that, right? 11:09 <@Bahhumbug> Dolemite: I do not have it bookmarked, sorry, 11:09 <@klixa> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGsQsY4zaQ8 Dickie 11:09 <@GateKeeper> Title: Interview with Drew Myers [JohnnyX] at Phreaknic 17 - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) 11:09 <@klixa> err Dolemite 11:10 <@klixa> is that the same one Bahhumbug ? 11:10 <@klixa> thats the one i saw anyway 11:10 <@Bahhumbug> That was it, yes. 11:10 <@benthemeek> Nah, I have a spine and balls ;) I can handle getting insulted- and the story I tell myself about what you guys say is that none of it is insults and you are raising valid concerns 11:10 <@Bahhumbug> Thank you, klixa. 11:10 <@klixa> thats not true, i insult you cause im sadistic Bahhumbug 11:10 <@klixa> benthemeek: ** 11:11 <@wilpig> valid concern: dru lives in his own fantasy world. invalid answer: i'll tell the truth for him 11:11 <@klixa> well benthemeek plays with lollaloopsies, so, not sure his world is any more real than dru's 11:11 <@klixa> :D 11:13 <@benthemeek> klixa: Oh no my secret is out! 11:13 <@Dolemite> Ok, I can't watch all of his interview. It's making me sleepy. 11:14 <@wilpig> iirc there is one spot in there that infuriated me. he was talking about the future and how things had been done behind his back 11:15 <@wilpig> now it's on the internet and you know it can't be on the internet if it isn't true 11:15 <@benthemeek> wilpig: I am watching for that point 11:16 <@shapr> GOOD MORNING 11:16 <@shapr> it's cold 11:16 <@shapr> but I have a new jacket 11:16 <@Dolemite> He lied at 11:28 11:16 <@Mirage_> wow..interview is 15m and i have 15m til my next webex meeting. good fit 11:16 <@Mirage_> Dolemite: SWGEmu finally implemented full Creature Handler yesterday...=) 11:17 <@benthemeek> There is a Cameo by Mog and Wilbur at 6:00 11:18 <@mog> ? 11:18 * wilpig sings and marches 11:18 <@Dolemite> Oddball and Tilghman are in there, too 11:18 <@wilpig> the mogs go marching two by two, hurrah! 11:18 <@benthemeek> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGsQsY4zaQ8 11:18 <@GateKeeper> Title: Interview with Drew Myers [JohnnyX] at Phreaknic 17 - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) 11:18 <@benthemeek> (For mog) 11:19 <@oddball> Dolemite: If I remember correctly, we were too busy getting shit done at the time. 11:19 <@Dolemite> He is so full of shit about the porn. He used to mention the 3-story porn movies when promoting PhreakNIC. 11:19 <@Mirage_> omg, pig sighting ~4m in 11:20 <@wilpig> those are special. 11:20 <@wilpig> treasure them 11:20 <@benthemeek> Did the porn thing not happen? 11:20 <@Dolemite> benthemeek: Oh it happened 11:20 <@benthemeek> I heard that story from Trevor. Always assumed it was true 11:20 <@wilpig> it most certainly happened 11:20 <@wilpig> devilcow happened. 11:20 <@Dolemite> But he claimed at the end of the interview that he "only knew about the video games happening - not the porn" 11:20 * wilpig shudders 11:21 <@benthemeek> This is a bad interview 11:21 <@Dolemite> If you tell people before an event that X will happen and then X happens, you knew about it. 11:21 <@benthemeek> its too free flow and not organized in a way to get information 11:21 <@klixa> he names pheaknic after a sex fest, so yeah he knew about the porn 11:21 <@klixa> named* 11:21 <@Dolemite> It's a very bad interview with very bad audio 11:21 <@benthemeek> "Now that they let me take it over again: 11:21 <@benthemeek> :( 11:22 <@benthemeek> okay there are some egos at work here 11:22 <@Mirage_> and pig is in it 11:22 <@Mirage_> benthemeek: and that suprises you how? 11:22 <@Dolemite> Well I know why attendance was down this year. He said in the interview that PN18 would be at the same hotel as PN17, so half of your attendees went to the wrong hotel! 11:23 <@benthemeek> Mirage: Big Ego often comes with the territory. 11:23 <@benthemeek> I had heard much about devilcow 11:24 <@benthemeek> She married Dink right? 11:24 <@Dolemite> Among others 11:24 <@Dolemite> First she married one of the twins 11:24 <@Dolemite> Gavin, I think 11:25 <@wilpig> Dolemite: damn those making public statements that just don't come true 11:25 <@Dolemite> ok, I'm off to lunch 11:25 <@wilpig> Dolemite: get me some bbq 11:32 <@Mirage_> wilpig: have fun w/ merlin and freinds? 11:32 <@Mirage_> s/freinds/friends/ 11:32 -!- CRasH180 [~CRasH180@pdpc/supporter/silver/CRasH180] has joined #se2600 11:32 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o CRasH180] by ChanServ 11:32 <@wilpig> Mirage_: we had a blast 11:32 <@wilpig> matt came up from huntsville and he knows a dude that works for facebook 11:33 <@wilpig> he's working with the occulus rift stuff and was a pretty nice dude 11:33 <@Mirage_> col 11:33 <@Mirage_> cool 11:33 <@wilpig> we hit up "the city bakery" for some hot chocolate then off to some ramen place, then a cocktail bar called "pouring ribbons" 11:34 <@wilpig> I left them after that and headed back cause I had to work sunday morning, but they went onto some 90's barcade 11:34 <@wilpig> something about virtua figher and tmnt? 11:34 <@Mirage_> come down here we'll drive to Fort Worth for greasy burgers and cold beer at "The Pour House" 11:35 <@wilpig> I'll come down for a visit sometime. y'all got a guest room? 11:35 <@Mirage_> one of the highlights of Chicago for me was hitting GameWorks and finding the "vintage" section. 11:35 <@wilpig> I should get down there to see my uncle robbie and aunt linda at some point too 11:35 <@Mirage_> yeah, we have a spare room 11:36 <@Mirage_> there's even a bed in there 11:36 <@wilpig> bonus! 11:36 <@wilpig> does it come with a spare cat as well? 11:36 <@Mirage_> only if you leave the door open 11:52 <@Dolemite> 11:52 <@Dolemite> Nothing burps better than bacon 11:53 <@wilpig> did you get my bbq? 12:00 <@Dolemite> Nah, bacon quiche 12:03 <@shapr> it's oh so quiet, it's oh so cold 12:20 <@Dagmar> It's definitely cold. 12:20 <@Dagmar> ...and it's probably time we discredited the "Bechdel Test" 12:20 <@oddball> !weather bna 12:20 <@GateKeeper> oddball: Nashville International, TN :: Overcast :: 31F | Wind Chill: 21F | Monday: Snow flurries or snow showers. High 34F. Winds WNW at 15 to 25 mph. Monday Night: Some clouds this evening will give way to mainly clear skies overnight. Low near 20F. Winds WNW at 10 to 20 mph. 12:20 <@Dagmar> oddball: Yes, it only gets colder from here. 12:21 <@oddball> ACtually, I think it's supposed to warm up this week. 12:21 <@Dagmar> No until after tomorrow 12:21 <@Dagmar> Wednesday morning is the first time we're supposed to see the temp go _up_ more than a handful of degrees 12:22 <@oddball> Hmmm... about the same for tomorrow, then in the mid to high 40's. 12:23 <@Dagmar> Seriously tho http://games.slashdot.org/story/14/11/17/1341201/sweden-considers-adding-sexism-ratings-to-video-games 12:23 <@GateKeeper> Title: Sweden Considers Adding "Sexism" Ratings To Video Games - Slashdot (at games.slashdot.org) 12:23 <@oddball> Oh... and Friday is supposed to be in the 40's and raining. Perfect weather to want to kill yourself. 12:23 <@Dagmar> The Bechdel Test is broken. 12:23 <@Dagmar> It doesn't demonstrate whether or not anything is "sexist" 12:24 <@oddball> Because, clearly, children shouldn't play Super Mario Bros, because the point of the game is to save the princess. 12:25 <@Dagmar> Right. It would likely be declared sexist 12:25 <@Dagmar> ...as would any game where there is a single-gender protagonist. 12:25 <@Dagmar> ...including that thing with Samus 12:25 < aestetix_> You know, I saw somehing where some feminists attacked Dr. Seuss 12:25 <@wilpig> samus? what about him? 12:26 < aestetix_> And he was like "my characters are all animals" 12:26 <@Dagmar> _Her_ 12:26 <@wilpig> him 12:26 <@wilpig> fuck you, 12:26 <@Dagmar> Just the same, the game would fail the Bechdel test 12:27 <@Dagmar> THe problem with the Bechdel Test is that it works correctly on genuinely sexist works, but has a MASSIVE window for false positives 12:27 <@Dagmar> i.e., many, many things which are not in fact sexist would _also_ be considered sexist. 12:27 <@Dagmar> From what I can tell, it's literally a 12:27 <@Dagmar> From what I can tell, it's literally a "3. ???" proposition 12:27 <@oddball> wilpig: Sorry, Samus has always been a woman. 12:27 <@wilpig> shut your filthy whore mouth. just because he has boobs he can still be a guy 12:28 <@Dagmar> heheh 12:28 <@Dagmar> A special, magical guy, according to Taiwan 12:28 < aestetix_> wilpig: just because she has a penis she can still be a girl 12:28 <@wilpig> how dare you pigeon hole him because he has boobs 12:28 <@Dagmar> I went and looked for a "formal" description of the Bechdel Test, and I'm not kidding 12:29 <@Dagmar> There's a massive logical gap in it. 12:29 <@shapr> what's the gap? 12:29 <@Dagmar> "1. Are there women in it?" 12:29 <@Dagmar> "2. Are they talking about something other than men?" 12:29 <@Dagmar> "3. ???" 12:29 <@Dagmar> "4. Sexism!" 12:29 <@wilpig> uh oh. kickass.to is autocorrecting to kickass.so 12:29 <@Dagmar> ...where it might as well be "4. ZEBRAS!" 12:30 <@Dagmar> The problem can most easily be illustrated with one completely fabricated test case 12:30 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:30 <@Dagmar> If a movie or a book is merely _about a male_ it will naturally and completely reasonably have the majority of the dialogue and scenes centering on that male. 12:30 <@Dagmar> ...which means it _will_ fail the Bechdel test. 12:31 <@Dagmar> ...and yet it is not necessarily true that this is _sexist_ 12:31 <@Dagmar> There's the logical gap. 12:31 <@shapr> interesting, a movie or book about a female that uses only internal dialogue could also fail the bechdel test. 12:32 <@Dagmar> It's probably more accurate to say that the Bechdel Test detects _misandry_ 12:32 <@Dagmar> ...except statements like that in public will get you met with pitchforks and torches. 12:33 <@Dagmar> shapr: The "test" is a good idea, but it's _deeply_ flawed logic 12:33 <@shapr> ok, how to improve it? 12:34 <@Dagmar> Beat the people who misuse it 12:34 <@wilpig> ban feminist 12:34 -!- CRasH180 [~CRasH180@pdpc/supporter/silver/CRasH180] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:34 <@shapr> no, I mean, what's a better test? 12:35 <@Dagmar> The problem is that the Bechdel Test doesn't actually do much other than ask if a work of fiction has at least two women in it that talk about something other than a man. 12:35 <@Dagmar> This means next to nothing by itself. 12:35 <@Dagmar> People are _abusing it_ to say that something which fails it demonstrates "gender bias" 12:35 <@Dagmar> ...which is then further conflated to mean "sexist". 12:35 <@shapr> ok, what would be a more discerning test? 12:36 <@Dagmar> One that actually looks for _sexism_ 12:36 <@Dagmar> Contrary to popular opinion, it's not hard to spot. 12:37 <@shapr> what would you consider easily noticed sexist features? 12:37 <@Dagmar> Undeserved dominance of one sex above the other. 12:37 <@Dagmar> You know, actual _sexism_ 12:37 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 12:37 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 12:37 <@shapr> I do think there's a problem with sexism in tech, but I think there's also a problem with reactionary pitchforks. 12:38 <@Dagmar> Yes, and I have a concern that Sweden is about to set a very bad example if they come up with their standards based on the Bechdel test 12:38 <@Dagmar> ...because there's no logic in how it's being applied to "detect sexism" 12:38 <@Dagmar> Just a whole bunch of weasel wording and conflated concepts 12:38 <@shapr> Sweden already has enough problems, believe me. 12:39 <@shapr> I lived there for five years, and dated a Swedish woman for awhile. 12:40 <@Dagmar> Like, the only nice thing I have to say about the Bechdel Test is that it's _clear_. 12:40 <@Dagmar> ...but it doesn't represent an accurate test for what people are trying to use it for. 12:40 <@Dagmar> http://bechdeltest.com/ <-- Moon fails 12:40 <@GateKeeper> Title: Bechdel Test Movie List (at bechdeltest.com) 12:40 <@Dagmar> Moon is a movie with literally ONE goddamn actor in it 12:40 <@Dagmar> ...who is male. 12:40 * Dagmar waves a finger in small circles. 12:41 <@Dagmar> It had to be _some_ gendor 12:41 <@Dagmar> er gender 12:41 <@Dagmar> When the fuck is Automata coming out damnit 12:41 <@shapr> is that a movie? 12:42 <@Dagmar> YES 12:42 <@Dagmar> I don't know if they were just similar ideas, but it looks like they took the idea from the Penny Arcade comic and ran with it 12:42 <@Dagmar> ...and I _want_ to see it 12:42 <@Dagmar> It probably fails the Bechdel Test, _until you take out all the robots_ 12:44 <@Dagmar> By the way, if you made Sam from _Moon_ a woman, it would be _exactly_ the type of movie that would needlessly fail that you mentioned above 12:44 <@Dagmar> This demonstrates clearly that the test is flawed, using the simple rules of logic. 12:44 <@Dagmar> Obversions must also be true, etc etc 12:46 <@Dagmar> http://academic.csuohio.edu/polen/LC9_Help/4/immediate.htm 12:46 <@GateKeeper> Title: Conversion, Obversion, and Contraposition (at academic.csuohio.edu) 12:47 <@Dagmar> I am very, very rusty with it, but I had a class in that in college and frankly it was probably the most useful thing I went to at MTSU 12:47 <@Dagmar> If you want to suss out a flaw in a chain of logic, there's formal rules for testing it. 12:48 <@Dagmar> With them you can determine whether something is both true and _valid_ 12:48 <@Dagmar> Application of these to the Bechdel Test proves that it is invalid for sexism. 13:07 <@Dolemite> How China interprets What Does the Fox Say? 13:07 <@Dolemite> http://boingboing.net/2014/11/17/calling-it-already-chinas.html 13:07 <@GateKeeper> Title: Calling it already: Chinas "Chick Chick" is the song of the year - Boing Boing (at boingboing.net) 13:10 <@Mirage_> Dolemite: thanks, needed that 13:16 <@Dolemite> Mirage_: I'll follow it up with http://geekologie.com/2014/11/choo-choo-mans-beatiful-train-engine-bbq.php 13:16 <@GateKeeper> Title: Choo Choo!: Man's Beatiful Train Engine BBQ Smoker | Geekologie (at geekologie.com) 13:30 <@benthemeek> That makes me think of lady gaga for some reason 13:32 <@klixa> this bechtel test thing tho, most women DO only talk about men... or recipes 13:32 <@klixa> im in a pregnant woman channel...men, babies, and food is all ANY of them talk about 13:32 <@klixa> how is shwing reality sexist 13:35 <@wilpig> you're brainwashed into only thinking about those things. you filthy sexist 13:46 <@klixa> ssh, im trying ton concetrate so i can make a sandwhich 13:50 * Dolemite fans the smoke coming out of klixa's ears 13:53 -!- klixa is now known as klixa12 13:59 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:02 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 14:02 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 14:02 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:02 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 14:02 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 14:25 < aestetix_> penis 14:41 <@shapr> VAINA 14:59 -!- npulse [~npulse@c-24-99-135-198.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:00 < RangerZ> we need a new 3rd gender to give aestetix_ something new to think about 15:06 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:06 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 15:06 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 15:06 < RangerZ> oddball: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lckogvHlhSg 15:06 <@GateKeeper> Title: Latest Amiibo Details for Hyrule Warriors - IGN News - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) 15:11 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:19 <@benthemeek> Has anyone managed to hack infinity/amiibo/skylanders to unlock the stuff with out paying all th emoney for a plastic figurine? 15:19 < RangerZ> yes 15:19 < RangerZ> on skylanders, they hacked the base 15:20 <@benthemeek> Or perhaps its worth it if the content is good enough, but from an outside stand point it looks like a gimmick 15:20 < RangerZ> honestly, smash is the only game so far where it makes sense, b/c they character levels up your own custom fight combos, etc 15:21 < RangerZ> but with that... its only really useful to have 1~2 amiibos 15:21 <@wilpig> in mario kart I know it unlocks different racing suits 15:22 < RangerZ> the thing is... they use public/private key pairs in the RFID chips (whatever 'exact' spec chip/radio they are using) 15:23 < RangerZ> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NleWpzXdpz0 hell... I didn't realize it still existed.... (ahh... it was only reruns now) 15:23 <@GateKeeper> Title: NBCUniversal Takes G4 Off the Air for Good - IGN News - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) 15:23 < RangerZ> 'ohh look... people want new content about games' << chocker 15:23 < RangerZ> shocker* 15:29 <@wilpig> trying to build an entire network around gaming would be rough but surely they can swing one or two shows 15:32 < RangerZ> nah 15:32 < RangerZ> they did it 15:32 < RangerZ> you could easily show starcraft streams 15:32 < RangerZ> to eat up time 15:32 < RangerZ> analysis 15:33 < RangerZ> LoL 15:33 < RangerZ> dota2 15:33 < RangerZ> etc 15:33 < RangerZ> let alone... news, reviews, etc 15:54 -!- RangerZ2 [~rangerz@c-69-137-107-2.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #se2600 15:54 -!- k3ymkr [~KeyMaker@gateway/tor-sasl/k3ymkr] has joined #se2600 15:56 <@wilpig> okay this nonpoint cover of I shot the sheriff is really fucking good! 15:56 -!- RangerZ1 [~rangerz@c-69-137-107-2.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:59 <@wilpig> all I can find are live versions of it though. meh. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtzvDVLM-7w 15:59 <@GateKeeper> Title: Nonpoint "I Shot The Sheriff" (Acoustic) - Earthday Birthday 2014 - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) 16:02 < aestetix_> ok so 16:02 < aestetix_> anyone here used DBaaS? 16:03 * benthemeek sings "All about DBaaS, bout DBaaS. No Treble.." 16:03 < aestetix_> lol 16:03 < aestetix_> Database as a service 16:04 <@benthemeek> ah. 16:04 < aestetix_> I'm seeing things that say "it's managed for you" 16:04 < aestetix_> And I don't trust it 16:05 -!- npulse [~npulse@c-24-99-135-198.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #se2600 16:05 <@Dickie> I'm sure it has its place 16:06 <@Dickie> If you have A database 16:06 <@Dickie> singular 16:07 <@Dagmar> ...or, if you're like some members of middle management, and have decided that it's perfectly reasonable for someone to promise five nines of uptime, 100tb of storage, and gigabit throughput for only $15/month, because it's a great cost savings! 16:07 <@Dagmar> Nevermind that the whole thing is hosted on a 586 on the far side of someone's cablemodem 16:07 -!- RangerZ2 [~rangerz@c-69-137-107-2.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:07 -!- RangerZ1 [~rangerz@c-69-137-107-2.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #se2600 16:07 < aestetix_> I'm on a project now that has DBaaS 16:07 <@Dagmar> To middle managers, empty promises == PROFIT 16:08 < aestetix_> the first question I asked was "is there replication?" 16:08 < aestetix_> the second question was "ok, where are the binary logs?" 16:09 -!- npulse [~npulse@c-24-99-135-198.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:10 -!- k3ymkr [~KeyMaker@gateway/tor-sasl/k3ymkr] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 16:12 -!- k3ymkr [~KeyMaker@gateway/tor-sasl/k3ymkr] has joined #se2600 16:17 <@Dagmar> I just don't see that being useful as a "service". 16:17 <@Dagmar> The only thing it'll lead to is empty promises making things _look_ cheaper 16:17 <@Dagmar> ...and less secure 16:19 -!- K4k [~K4k@unaffiliated/k4k] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:21 < RangerZ> Dagmar: you worked in a data center 16:21 < RangerZ> a data center IS _as a service_ 16:22 < RangerZ> just in house 16:22 <@Dagmar> Yes, and they tend to be very, very specific about what they promise... AND you can actually look and see that they have the relevant equipment in place. 16:22 <@Dagmar> A data center's promises are easy to audit. 16:22 <@Dagmar> You can even have various auditing organizations give you a stamp of approval if you run one. 16:23 < RangerZ> then its more of an issue of '_as a service_ doesn't offer enough transparency" 16:24 < aestetix_> So the things I'm looking for right now 16:24 < aestetix_> For a DBaaS.... can you add indexes? Can you see the my.cnf file? etc 16:24 <@Dagmar> Precisely. 16:24 < aestetix_> The answer seems to be no 16:25 <@Dagmar> A database is a very complex thing 16:25 < aestetix_> I don't trust a service to handle that stuff automatically. 16:25 < aestetix_> I mean one of the reasons for replication is to have the binary logs 16:25 <@Dagmar> Either you can get away with just running it on whatever, or it's key to your business and you can't afford to fuck around 16:25 <@Dagmar> huhwhat? 16:25 < aestetix_> lol 16:25 <@Dagmar> No the reason for replication is to have redundancy 16:25 < aestetix_> Yes I realize that. 16:25 <@Dagmar> Binary logs are a useful side effect 16:26 < aestetix_> However, having the binary logs is incredibly useful. 16:26 < aestetix_> In case for example someone deletes some data because they were a fucking moron 16:29 < RangerZ> i'm really surprised that a distributed DB hasn't popped up 16:29 < RangerZ> b/c "distributed hash table" has existed for a while 16:31 < RangerZ> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distributed_database ok... so it appears that oracle and apache and a few others are actually trying to implement it 16:31 <@GateKeeper> Title: Distributed database - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at en.wikipedia.org) 16:31 < RangerZ> but I'm guessing the required networking overhead and what not... is killing it in production 16:35 < RangerZ> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_QtQ53IQiE hehe 16:35 <@GateKeeper> Title: Worlds Greatest Victory Dance - Goal | PS4 - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) 16:35 < RangerZ> Sometimes I feel that SONY should just give up the home consumer electronics other than PlayStation... 16:36 < RangerZ> b/c thats amusing 16:36 < RangerZ> (and movies and Playstation are the only two divisions of SONY that come close to breaking even/making money consistently) 16:37 < RangerZ> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4v1-6cWacU hehehe... there are a few of these... 16:37 <@GateKeeper> Title: World’s Greatest Victory Dance: Laser | PS4 - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) 16:45 < aestetix_> RangerZ: because it is hard 16:45 < aestetix_> RangerZ: like try doing a join over a distributed db 16:52 < RangerZ> aestetix_: its not 'hard' 16:52 < RangerZ> its 'difficult to do properly' 16:52 < RangerZ> its easy 'to do' wrongly, lol 16:58 < RangerZ> aestetix_: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrlAQ-AWnQ0 16:58 <@GateKeeper> Title: Ex-Ubisoft Employee Exposes The Horrors Of The Company - YouTube (at www.youtube.com) 16:58 < RangerZ> listen to the work-enviorment 16:58 < RangerZ> environment* 17:02 < RangerZ> thank god he didn't say anything about how IT should "have lives" 17:02 < RangerZ> thankfully we can still (according to popular beliefs) treat them like slaves 17:02 < RangerZ> lol 17:06 -!- dare2netsec [~Rusty@cpe-075-190-255-214.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #se2600 17:15 < aestetix_> http://ow.ly/i/7Cj6j 17:19 -!- npulse [~npulse@c-24-99-135-198.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #se2600 17:54 <@wilpig> aestetix_: wtf? is that real? 17:56 < aestetix_> wilpig: is what real? 17:56 <@wilpig> that snapchat update 17:57 <@Dagmar> looool 17:57 <@Dagmar> It's real 17:57 <@wilpig> taking camwhoring to the next logical step 17:59 < aestetix_> oh 18:00 <@Dagmar> I would question more whether or not *this* is real https://www.telltalegames.com/talesfromtheborderlands/ 18:00 <@GateKeeper> Title: Tales from the Borderlands - Telltale Games (at www.telltalegames.com) 18:01 -!- spaceB0x [~spaceB0x@162.218.105.210] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 18:09 < RangerZ1> Dagmar: it is 18:10 <@Dagmar> I just don't see the storylines as being that compelling 18:11 < RangerZ1> thats their biggest selling point to 'some' people 18:14 < aestetix_> oh interesting 18:14 < aestetix_> so DBaaS is just a frontend. I can still access the db 18:16 < RangerZ1> a lot of the aaS are just written that way to fit into marketing/'in' terms... such as our SIMaaS 18:16 < RangerZ1> Simulation as a serverice 18:16 < RangerZ1> service* 18:17 < RangerZ1> We've tried simulating wilpig getting a date... but the entire EC2 cloud crashed when we tried it :/ 18:18 <@shapr> ouch 18:18 < aestetix_> the one issue is I can't directly access the logs, grr 18:18 < RangerZ1> shapr: the issue is... I don't think he wants one 18:18 < aestetix_> RangerZ: you can only simulate the probable. 18:19 <@shapr> I want a date! 18:19 < RangerZ1> honestly... I'm at the point where I didn't care about dating at all 18:19 < aestetix_> shapr: if you ask nicely I'm sure RangerZ will put on a skirt for you 18:19 < RangerZ1> no 18:19 < RangerZ1> he has to pay 18:20 <@shapr> um, no 18:20 < aestetix_> RangerZ: services are supposed to be free 18:20 < aestetix_> like gmail 18:21 < RangerZ1> shapr: I'd love to have a nice g/f... but I don't want to bother with the entire 'dating' thing right now 18:21 <@Dagmar> What's the slash for?> 18:21 -!- k3ymkr [~KeyMaker@gateway/tor-sasl/k3ymkr] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:21 < RangerZ1> huh? 18:22 < RangerZ1> g/f = girlfriend 18:22 < aestetix_> RangerZ: why not ask Corydon on a date? 18:22 < RangerZ1> because I'm not you 18:45 -!- cordless_ [cordless@50708355.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:47 <@Shadow404> aestetix_: yo 18:47 <@Shadow404> u rang 18:49 -!- PeteDaGuru [~PeteDaGur@user-0c99bgh.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:02 -!- Catonic [~catonic@adsl-98-83-48-190.bhm.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:08 -!- cordless [~cordless@50708355.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #se2600 19:14 < RangerZ1> Shadow404: you looking forward to the new portal 3 ? 19:15 < RangerZ1> thats one of the new games that is suppose to be with the 'new' source engine valve is working on... 19:15 < RangerZ1> but who knows when it'll ever get released 19:37 <@Shadow404> portal 3? seriously? 19:37 <@Shadow404> heh, like hl2ep3 19:37 <@Shadow404> never 19:42 -!- Dickie [~Dickie@unaffiliated/dickie] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:53 -!- Dickie [~Dickie@unaffiliated/dickie] has joined #se2600 19:53 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o Dickie] by ChanServ 20:40 -!- scoob [~scoob@fsf/member/scoob] has quit [Quit: ruh roh] 20:48 -!- scoob [~scoob@fsf/member/scoob] has joined #se2600 21:07 <@Dagmar> Just waiting for them to announce HL3 on April 1st. 21:08 <@Dagmar> ...and watch as the Internet tears itself apart. 21:08 -!- Catonic [~catonic@adsl-98-71-67-50.bhm.bellsouth.net] has joined #se2600 21:08 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o Catonic] by ChanServ 21:29 < RangerZ1> HAHAHA GOP was using digital Dead Drops to share internal info that is illegal to share with campaigns 21:33 < RangerZ1> twitter.... 21:33 < RangerZ1> you know... thats enough reason for me to say we should just shut down twitter 21:38 -!- scoob [~scoob@fsf/member/scoob] has quit [Quit: ruh roh] 21:49 < aestetix_> wait what? 21:49 < aestetix_> so the GOP is opposed to whistleblowers but they are ok with using dead drops for illegal funding 22:01 < RangerZ1> shh 22:01 < RangerZ1> its not illegal if the (gop) president does it 22:01 < RangerZ1> but it is if the (Democrat) president does it 22:01 < RangerZ1> lol 22:08 -!- npulse [~npulse@c-24-99-135-198.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:12 -!- spaceB0x [~spaceb0x@108-197-68-178.lightspeed.nsvltn.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 22:27 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has joined #se2600 22:27 -!- mode/#se2600 [+o SuMo_D] by ChanServ 22:28 -!- SuMo_D [~sumo_d@108-193-45-205.lightspeed.gnvlsc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:35 -!- npulse [~npulse@c-24-99-135-198.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #se2600 22:47 < RangerZ1> http://blog.chron.com/goplifer/2014/11/the-missing-story-of-the-2014-election/ 22:47 <@GateKeeper> Title: The missing story of the 2014 election - GOPlifer (at blog.chron.com) 22:47 < RangerZ1> a republican saying "republicans will not win the presidency for generation at this rate" basically, lol 22:48 < RangerZ1> "This means that the next Presidential election, and all subsequent ones until a future party realignment, will be decided in the Democratic primary." 22:52 -!- spaceB0x [~spaceb0x@108-197-68-178.lightspeed.nsvltn.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:11 < RangerZ1> I found aestetix_'s manga .... http://bato.to/comic/_/comics/the-penisman-r13436 23:18 < RangerZ1> so MO has its national gaurd called up, and is in a state of emergency 23:18 < RangerZ1> apparently the weather has been horrible there.... 23:18 < RangerZ1> OR... The ferguson Grand Jury results are about to come out tomorrow.... 23:24 <@oddball> I predict that they declare that the cop is in the clear. 23:24 < RangerZ1> yeah.... 23:24 < RangerZ1> because the DA refused to even talk 23:24 < RangerZ1> we ALL know that DAs could get a grilled cheese sandwich indicted 23:24 < RangerZ1> if they wanted 23:25 <@oddball> Which, frankly, is the right call. Both sides should shut the fuck up while things are still going on in the court room. 23:25 < RangerZ1> thing is.... this is only the begining 23:26 < RangerZ1> b/c they can bring charges _forever_ on this cop 23:26 <@oddball> Sad thing is that the evidence that has leaked out has shown that the shooting might be the only thing the police in Ferguson have done *right* in years. 23:26 < RangerZ1> b/c he won't be found 'not guilty' just not charged yet 23:26 < RangerZ1> oddball: the first shooting sure... but not the end of it 23:26 < RangerZ1> thats the thing, legally if he was running away, the cop didn't have the right to shoot him 23:27 <@oddball> Right. The aftermath was a complete cluster fuck. 23:27 < RangerZ1> let alone... the days afterwards 23:27 <@oddball> But there has apparently been evidence and witnesses that have shown that the cops story of the guy being shot while trying to pull the cop out through the car's window has merit. 23:28 < RangerZ1> i agree 23:28 < RangerZ1> but thats the first shooting 23:28 < RangerZ1> not the 2nd part 23:28 < RangerZ1> where he was 20ft+ away 23:28 <@oddball> I was unaware that there was a second part. 23:29 < RangerZ1> yeah, the first shot was at the car, thats never been under debate 23:29 < RangerZ1> the later shots were when he was 20~30+ ft away 23:29 <@oddball> ah, I was under the impression that there was a question of whether he was shot up close or at 20-30ft. 23:29 < RangerZ1> no, he did both 23:29 <@oddball> ah. 23:30 < RangerZ1> the first shot(s) are legal 23:30 < RangerZ1> the 2nd set are under question 23:30 <@oddball> Yeah. First shots were clear cut self defense. 23:30 < RangerZ1> but basically... there is almost no legal justification for shooting an unarmed person 30ft away 23:30 < RangerZ1> which is why they said he was 'preparing to charge' the cop 23:30 <@oddball> Yeah. That's damned hard to justify. 23:32 <@oddball> Although, cops are trained to treat anyone within 20ft as if they are up close and personal, since you probably won't be able to clear the holster and shoot them if they charge you with a knife. 23:32 < RangerZ1> yeah 23:33 < RangerZ1> but he had his gun drawn already....obviously... 23:33 <@oddball> right 23:33 < aestetix_> https://github.com/mapmeld/profanity65 23:34 < RangerZ1> aestetix_: very 'professional' 23:34 < aestetix_> it's secure 23:34 <@oddball> At least it wasn't NY. The cop would have done a magazine dump for the first shooting, reloaded, done another magazine dump, reloaded, and fired a few more time while actually hitting the subject maybe 3 times. 23:34 < RangerZ1> plus GPL3 23:34 < RangerZ1> fuck that nonsense 23:35 < RangerZ1> hmmm.... 23:35 < RangerZ1> i wonder... 23:35 <@oddball> And then the prosecutor would have slapped the subject with attempted murder charges for all the rounds that missed him and struck bystanders. 23:35 < RangerZ1> if the SCOTUS declares APIs as non-protected... it might fuck over GPL3 'anti-tivo-ization' 23:35 < RangerZ1> b/c you could just declare that the API is what is being used 23:36 < RangerZ1> hmm... 23:36 < RangerZ1> i wonder what a legal scholar in the field would say about that... 23:36 < RangerZ1> which honestly... if thats what it takes to get APIs to be non-protected 23:36 <@oddball> And, of course, the aggrivating thing with all of this is that all the stuff that the cops did during the initial protests has quietly gone away. 23:36 < RangerZ1> so fucking be it 23:37 < RangerZ1> oddball b/c the police helis were grounded 23:37 < RangerZ1> and news on THAT came out recently too 23:37 < RangerZ1> its all fucking BS 23:37 < aestetix_> wait 23:37 < aestetix_> is this the shit in missouri? 23:37 <@oddball> yep 23:37 < RangerZ1> ferguson MO 23:37 < RangerZ1> grand jury result coming out tomorrow 23:38 < RangerZ1> and 'likely' to not charge him 23:38 < RangerZ1> BUT... if a new DA is elected ... THAT DA could charge him 23:38 <@oddball> Expect more reporters randomly gassed by the cops. 23:38 < RangerZ1> Offier Wilson will NEVER have legal protection from being charged... until he's found 'not guilty' in a trial 23:38 <@oddball> RangerZ1: I'm honestly not sure how that works. 23:38 < aestetix_> RangerZ1: is that likely? 23:39 < RangerZ1> is what likely? new DA? 23:39 < aestetix_> Wilson being found not guilty 23:39 < RangerZ1> if the blacks in the area register and vote 23:39 < RangerZ1> yes 23:39 < RangerZ1> aestetix_: him found 'guilty' or not 23:40 < RangerZ1> not likley for now 23:40 < RangerZ1> b/c he won't be charged 23:40 < RangerZ1> 'grand jury' decides whether or not to CHARGE him, not the 'guilty or not guilty' 23:40 <@oddball> aestetix_: Grand jury... not actual trial. 23:41 < RangerZ1> the DA didn't even NEED to go to the Grand Jury 23:41 < RangerZ1> he just decided to 23:42 < RangerZ1> which means the DA didn't want charges anyways 23:43 <@oddball> I thought the grand jury was kind of a requirement. 23:43 < RangerZ1> oddball: you now what... its really sad... but now that Unity is playing fine... I don't even like it really 23:43 < RangerZ1> oddball: not in that State 23:43 <@oddball> huh 23:43 < RangerZ1> its an option 23:44 < RangerZ1> or something... 23:44 < RangerZ1> honestly its just a cluster fuck... so i dunno 23:44 <@oddball> So... yeah... pretty much says for a high profile case that the DA either has no actual interest/doesn't think the guys guilty, but has to go through the motions due to political pressure. 23:52 < aestetix_> it sounds like this is becoming the 21st century's bonfire of the vanities 23:58 < aestetix_> penis 23:59 < RangerZ1> no more like 21st century The Producers 23:59 < RangerZ1> with Springtime for Hitler 23:59 < RangerZ1> now in Ferguson 23:59 < aestetix_> but that movie was funny --- Log closed Tue Nov 18 00:00:08 2014